{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/iiif/zp3vt1h002/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["Interview with Jimmy Johnson and Freddie Johnson, October 16, 2008"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/002/original/1b9c652bf856b30cc9684b8a547e8758.png?1549330641","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Agent"]},"value":{"en":["Freddie Johnson (Interviewee)","Thomas Troland (Interviewer)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Date"]},"value":{"en":["2008-10-16 (created)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Identifier"]},"value":{"en":["2009oh019_bik002 (cms record id)","2009OH019 BIK 002 (accession number)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Relation"]},"value":{"en":["Buffalo Trace Oral History Project (BIK003) (is part of)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Format"]},"value":{"en":["video"]}},{"label":{"en":["Description"]},"value":{"en":["Jimmy Johnson is a retired foreman who worked for many years at Buffalo Trace, primarily in the warehouses. Freddie Johnson, his son, is a former engineer who now works as a tour guide at Buffalo Trace. Both grew up in Frankfort, Kentucky. In this interview, Jimmy and Freddie Johnson describe what it was like to grow up in Kentucky and how they began working at the distillery. Jimmy describes what the distillery was like in the 1940s and 1950s and explains his rise to the position of foreman. He talks about his treatment at the distillery as an African American, explaining that Buffalo Trace did not tolerate racism. Jimmy also discusses Colonel Albert Blanton, a former president of the distillery.  Jimmy and Freddie emphasize the importance of community and history at the distillery. They explain how the distillery has changed over time, but stress that the fundamentals of producing bourbon remain unchanged. (summary)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Keyword"]},"value":{"en":["Colonel Albert B. Blanton","Military service, Voluntary--United States.","Distilling, illicit","African Americans--Segregation","Childhood","Families."]}},{"label":{"en":["Subject"]},"value":{"en":["Buffalo Trace Distillery (local term)","Distillers. (local term)","Distillation. (local term)","Whiskey. (local term)","Buffalo Trace Distillery. (local term)","Distilleries--Kentucky (local term)","Whiskey industry--Kentucky (local term)","African Americans in the whiskey industry (local term)","Frankfort (Ky.) (local term)","Blanton, Albert B. (Albert Bacon), 1881-1959 (local term)","Bourbon whiskey (local term)","Race relations--Kentucky (local term)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Rights Statement"]},"value":{"en":["All rights to the interviews, including but not restricted to legal title, copyrights and literary property rights, have been transferred to the University of Kentucky Libraries.","Interviews may only be reproduced with permission from Louie B. Nunn Center for Oral History, Special Collections and Digital Programs, University of Kentucky Libraries."]}},{"label":{"en":["Source Metadata URI"]},"value":{"en":["00048046 (2009oh019_bik002_johnson_ohm.xml)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Duration"]},"value":{"en":["01:56:47"]}}],"summary":{"en":["Jimmy Johnson is a retired foreman who worked for many years at Buffalo Trace, primarily in the warehouses. Freddie Johnson, his son, is a former engineer who now works as a tour guide at Buffalo Trace. Both grew up in Frankfort, Kentucky. In this interview, Jimmy and Freddie Johnson describe what it was like to grow up in Kentucky and how they began working at the distillery. Jimmy describes what the distillery was like in the 1940s and 1950s and explains his rise to the position of foreman. He talks about his treatment at the distillery as an African American, explaining that Buffalo Trace did not tolerate racism. Jimmy also discusses Colonel Albert Blanton, a former president of the distillery.  Jimmy and Freddie emphasize the importance of community and history at the distillery. They explain how the distillery has changed over time, but stress that the fundamentals of producing bourbon remain unchanged."]},"requiredStatement":{"label":{"en":["Attribution"]},"value":{"en":["All rights to the interviews, including but not restricted to legal title, copyrights and literary property rights, have been transferred to the University of Kentucky Libraries.","Interviews may only be reproduced with permission from Louie B. Nunn Center for Oral History, Special Collections and Digital Programs, University of Kentucky Libraries."]}},"provider":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["Louie B. Nunn Center for Oral History"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["Louie B. Nunn Center for Oral History"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/002/original/1b9c652bf856b30cc9684b8a547e8758.png?1549330641","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/000/003/small/open-uri20190204-2161-1wwi8tz?1549331299","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 1 - 2009oh019_bik002_johnson_acc003 from Nunn Center for Oral History on Vimeo"]},"duration":7007.0,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/000/003/small/open-uri20190204-2161-1wwi8tz?1549331299","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://player.vimeo.com/video/253463582","type":"Video","format":"video/vimeo","duration":7007.0,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["2009oh019_bik002_johnson_ohm.xml [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TROLAND: My name is Tom Troland, and, uh, we're here today interviewing,\nuh, Freddie Johnson on the left and Jimmy Johnson on the right.  Uh,\ntoday is October 16, 2008; this is part of the Buffalo Trace Oral\nHistory Project, uh and we are undertaking these interviews at the\nBuffalo Trace Distillery.  So let's start, uh, let's start with a\nquestion for you, Jimmy.  Uh, tell me just a little bit about yourself.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Well, um, I was born behind the Frankfort Cemetery.  Uh,\ngrandfather's property joined the, the Frankfort Cemetery, and that's\nwhere I was born on, uh, Leestown Road.  And I had to walk, at six\nyears old, I walked from behind the Frankfort Cemetery out to the,\nto the main ro-, street and then from up the street to the Rosenwald\nSchool at six years old by myself, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=0.0,60.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and, uh, after so long a time, we\nmoved from there up to the school--up by the school.  Then by that\ntime, I am going to high school and that's down in Frankfort, so I got\nto walk from, uh, school, from the hill all the way back to--down to\nFrankfort now so I spent a lot of my time just walking back and forth\nto school; not so much that I was learning anything but that, that\nwas the way that I had to get along.  And after so long a time while\nI was out there, while we were out there behind the cemetery, uh, my\ngrandfather worked up in the cemetery, and he got a little job for me,\nuh, keeping to--uh, three lots.  We had three lots up there that I kept\nthe grass and stuff cut on it and that was around eight or nine years\nold.  And the main man down to the cetery, down to the, uh, cemetery,\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=60.0,120.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"he got me a special little lawn mower that a little small boy, that I\ncould push, see, and cut the grass on those lots.  And a lot of days,\nuh, the people came by in, in automobiles with running boards on them\nat that time, and they would ask me do, did I know where Daniel Boone's\nmonument was? And I'd tell 'em, \"Yes.\" Then I'd get on the running\nboard and direct them around to Daniel Boone monument and then show\nthem two or three more things around there in the cemetery, and when\nthey got, when I got off they'd maybe give me a dime or fifteen cents.\nAnd if I got a quarter, that was big money back there then in the\ntwenties; that was big money.  And some days I made more money showing\npeople where Daniel Boone's monument was than my granddaddy made, and\nhe was working there by the, by the day.  And I would be mention to\nsay that I have shown more people where Daniel Boone's monument was\nthan ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=120.0,180.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"anybody else in the world. That sounds to, something to brag of,\nbut that was, back there then and now, they have, uh, the signs that\ndirect you to it, so they don't need to ask anybody now, but ba-back\nthen sometimes you'd get off of one car and there'd be another one\ndrive up and ask you, Can you show me the Daniel Boone monument? You\nget right on that one and take right on off again.  And the, the um,\nboss thought so much of me--he had a Cadillac, and it--can you imagine\nme just barely looking over the, the wheel setting in his lap driving\nhis Cadillac.  That's the kind of, he just thought that much of me that\nhe would let me drive his Cadillac just straight down the road and then\nsitting in his lap.  So that's the kind of little childhood that I had\ncoming along.  And another thing, uh, one night the--I wanted to go to,\nto the picture show on ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=180.0,240.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Halloween, and so my granddad told me no. Said,\n\"No you don't need to go down there.  It's too dark--going to be too\ndark when you get out of the picture show.\" And I begged him to let me\ngo and went to the picture show and came back up the--and cut through\nthe cemetery going home, where we lived (??).  And just about the time\nI got halfway up the, the cemetery walk, we had a ol' horse over there,\nand I woke the ol' horse and he stomped about three times.  And that's\nall it took to get me through that cemetery in a hurry.  I, I (laughs)\ndidn't stop running till I hit the front porch.  Yes.  So that's enough\nof the type of life that I lived around, up on the hill.\n \n \n[Pause in recording.]\n \n \nTROLAND: Actually, are we rolling again here?\n \nHAY: We're rolling again.\n \nTROLAND: Okay.  Good.\n \nF. JOHNSON: I was going to say his childhood, it was really interesting.\nMy father had a little tricycle, and he would ride that tricycle ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=240.0,300.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"now--\nthe place that he was referring to is Glen's Creek Road next to Frankfort\nCemetery--and he would ride that tricycle from up by East Main all the\nway down to the bottom of Glen's Creek Road where the creek goes down\nthrough there.  And he would do that, what, everyday just about.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Just about every day, and I had two friends, uh, that,\nuh--well, I'm going to say it like this--I had two white friends that's\nabout my age, and uh, that's just all, they had-we had a old billy goat\nand a hound dog that everywhere we went, that they went with us.  And,\nuh, we'd go down to the creek, go in swimming no clothes on, and if\nanybody came along we'd run up in the tunnel and then put our clothes\non back up in the sun.  That's just boys for you, and yet still we just\nplayed together all the time.  And we had a old four-wheel, uh, plank\nwith four wheels on it, that we'd wait for the Freemont ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=300.0,360.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Institute wagon\nto come in to twelve o'clock, to come from over on the farm, Freemont\nInstitute Farm, to the main building to pick up the lunch, and then\nwe'd get on this thing and ride it down the hill.  And then they would\npull us back up the hill, with the wagon and mules, they'd pull us back\nup the hill.  And it was just the, that was the type of childhood we\ncame up with; just nothing bad but just still those were the type of\nways that we enjoyed ourselves.  Yes, indeed-y.\n \nTROLAND: Freddie, tell me a little bit about yourself.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Um, born in Paris, Kentucky--uh, Bourbon County--and, uh,\nspent, uh, most of my childhood here in Frankfort, Kentucky.  Uh, we\nwere in south Frankfort when, uh, when we first started off here in,\nuh, Frankfort, and then from south Frankfort, um, moved up on East\nMain, uh, right at Kentucky State University.  So we stayed with our,\nuh, my great-grandfather ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=360.0,420.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for awhile and then he was right across the\nstreet, and then we moved into, uh, our home on Langford Avenue.  So\nbasically that was our home, so my daughter never experienced what I\nwent through and that was to live in one house basically the, my entire\nchildhood.  Uh, but we would get to go to my other grandfather's, so\nI was fortunate enough to have two grandfather's that I thoroughly\nenjoyed both.  One was in the distillery-making business, and uh, in\nthe whiskey making business--and my other grandfather was, uh, lived\nin Breathitt County--Jackson, Kentucky--and he mined his own coal.  And\nthe uh, moonshiners and my grandfather had a very close relationship.\nThey, uh--they used his coal mines after the vein ran out to, uh, make\nmoonshine, so uh, uh, my childhood was one of, uh, hunting, fishing,\nhaving fun and, uh, I got ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=420.0,480.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to, I got a chance to do that with both my\nfather and my grandfather.  So I had, I had the, I didn't have a lot of\nthe stress and pressures that the kids had today.  Uh, mine was pretty\nmuch just enjoying life and enjoying nature and hunting, fishing,\nswimming, acting crazy.  The only rule that we had was, uh, when we\nwere back up in the mountains if we encountered someone that we did not\nknow or we saw someone walking around that we didn't feel good about,\nwe weren't to talk to them.  We were to immediately come back down\nthe mountainside to our grandfather's house and to tell him who we saw\nand where we saw them.  And usually that meant that was the revenuer\nwalking around on the ridge looking for that moonshine still.  So uh,\nyeah we learned at an early age there were people that came up into the\nmountains, and they disappeared and nobody asked any questions and you\njust left it alone.\n \nTROLAND: What was your favorite brand of ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=480.0,540.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"moonshine?\n \nF. JOHNSON: I--(laughs)--it was just in a mason jar but, uh, you could\ntell good moonshine from uh, cheap moonshine just by shaking it.  They\ncall it a \"string of pearls\" and if it's a hundred proof or better,\nwhen you shake that mason jar it'll make a little row of bubbles\ncompletely around, uh, the liquid on the inside, and that tells you\nthat, that moonshine is at least a hundred proof.\n \nTROLAND: Have you ever tried that experiment with a Buffalo Trace\nproduct?\n \nF. JOHNSON: Yes.  Buffalo Trace ninety proof goes almost all the way\naround.  It'll lack a couple of bubbles each time you do it, and that\nshows that it's at ninety proof and not quite a hundred.\n \nTROLAND: Now, Jimmy, uh, your dad--Freddie, your grandfather--\n \nF. JOHNSON: Did you notice he was getting ready to crank up here.  He\nwas getting ready to share another little--(laughs).\n \nJ. JOHNSON: I was getting ready to tell you, uh, that the little creek\nhe was talking about up in the mountains, uh, (Freddie laughs) my\nwife's ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=540.0,600.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"father was there, was the oldest one that bragged about he had\nrunning water in his toilet, and they lived up in the mountains.  And\ncome to find out, he had built his toilet over this little stream of\nthe branch that went down through there, and he had running water in\nhis toilet.  Do, are you, are you getting the picture? (Freddie laughs)\nAnd yet still where the water is running down this, this little branch,\nthere's no telling how many homes that are down below.  He's at the\nhead of the mountain up here with running water in his toilet.  But all\nthe way down through there--(laughs)--I'm just letting you know how,\nhow he could brag about having wa-, running water in his toilet, and\nyet still everybody else was suffering that lived down below him.  Yes,\nsir.  That was just Papa Strong.\n \nTROLAND: Indeed, he had a head in the mountains.  No question about it.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Um, Tom, something interesting ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=600.0,660.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about--you just made me think\nabout something--something interesting about growing up as a child\nin, uh, in this environment, um, that we're in.  Um, our parents, the\nway that our--I guess the way our family was constructed-- most kids\nliked to come to our house, so they considered, uh, my mother and my\nfather extensions of their own family.  So they were known as Mama\nJo and Papa Jim, and someone called him Daddy Jim.  Um, but, uh, the\nsaying, I guess the saying is, \"Show me your friends, and I'll tell\nyou who you are.\" So their view was, uh, if you, if you have friends,\nyou shouldn't be ashamed to bring 'em to the house, and so that was the\nrule.  So anybody that we ran with always came to the house to visit,\nthey'd have dinner; we'd do things together.  But, uh, that was the way\nwe operated; so if we were ashamed of ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=660.0,720.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"someone that we were associating\nwith, we knew that if we didn't feel comfortable about bringing them\nto the house, we probably didn't need to be around them.  So it's just\nsubtle little things that they did that got you through life.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah.  Like when I had you to tie the rope on the tree just\nwhen I was getting ready to cut it down, but the tree had to fall a\ncertain way to keep from falling on any, any of the buildings around\nthere, so I got--\n \nF. JOHNSON: Now, let's, let's talk about how this thing got started.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: What was it?\n \nF. JOHNSON: You saw a tree that looked like it was dying.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah.\n \nF. JOHNSON: And you said, \"We need to get this tree outta here before\nit damages the little shed or some of the other stuff around the yard.\"\nAnd as your trusting little son, I said, \"Yeah.  I guess you're right,\nDad.\" So he gives me a rope to go up in the tree to tie it off so that\nwe ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=720.0,780.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"can cut this tree and pull it in the right direction so it won't\ndamage anything when it comes down.  Now, you tell them what you did\nto me.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: (laughs) Well, uh, well, wait, he climbed up in the tree,\nand he was tying the rope in a knot.  And I said, \"Wait a minute.\nLet me check it to see if it's, uh, you know, if the knot is going to\nhold.\" And, of course, I jerked it and do you know what happened? Here\ncome tree, Freddie and all.  Crash.  (Laughs)\n \nF. JOHNSON: He pulled me down with the tree, and all I remember was, I'm\nfalling.  And I can't jump out of the tree because if I do, I'm really\ngoing to get hurt.  So the only thing I need to do is when we were\nkids--uh, kids today don't even know about this kind of stuff--uh, we\ncalled them tree horses.  There are certain types of trees that are,\nlike, saplings as they start to grow pretty ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=780.0,840.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"big, you can get on them\nand you climb way up in them, and you can rock them.  And you keep\nrocking them like that and they'll actually come over like that, and\nyou ride them just like a horse and it just takes you up and down in\na big sweeping motion.  And the only thing I could remember when that\ntree started to fall was to swing around on the upper part of the tree\nand ride it down like the tree horses that we used to play in.  When\nthe tree finally hit the ground, it threw me out, and when I landed,\nI was at his feet and all I could see were stars.  And, and all of a\nsudden I realized that he was standing over me looking down saying,\n\"Well, are you all right?\"\n \nJ. JOHNSON: (Laughs)\n \nF. JOHNSON: And I wasn't sure.  He said, \"Well it looks like we got the\ntree down without cutting it.\" That was his resolution to the problem:\n\"Are you all right? Well, it looks like we got the tree down without\ncutting it.\" Right? (laughs)\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Oh.\n \nF. JOHNSON: So anyway.\n \nTROLAND: Now, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=840.0,900.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Freddie, is this the worst example you can give of\nmistreatment by your father?\n \nF. JOHNSON: No.  No.  No.  No.  No.  No.  We've, we've got many moments\nlike that, that were--you begin to get gun shy.  He told me at one\npoint, he said, \"You know, it's a fool that gets bit by the same dog\ntwice.\" (laughs)\n \nF. JOHNSON: But, uh, we've had, um--it's kind of interesting.  Uh, I\nguess we've done things together just about all the time; all through\nlife.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Um-hm.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Um, we used to go on fishing trips, and I had a group of\nguys that we'd grown up together with.  We'd all get together--we'd all\nmoved to other parts of the country--we'd all get together once a year\nhere in Kentucky.  We'd go fishing at, uh, Lake Barkley or Kentucky\nLake.  We'd rent a cottage, and there was usually about, uh, usually\nabout eight to ten of us at a time.  And, uh, we'd have our boats and\neverything.  We'd all go fishing, and every year that we did this--now\nwe've been doing this for about fifteen years--every year that we\ndid this, Dad would say, \"Well, you all have a good ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=900.0,960.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"time.\" And \"Catch\nanything, bring some back\" and, you know, \"bring--save some for old\ndad.\" And say, \"Okay, Dad.\" Well this one particular year, one of the\nguys had already paid for his trip and he couldn't make it; he had to\ncancel.  And so we had an extra spot, and so we were wondering around,\nwondering what we're going to do and Dad was just sitting there on the\nporch.  So one of the guys said, \"Well, why don't you ask your dad? See\nif he'd like to go fishing.\" You know, if he'd want to run down there\nwith us.  We go up to ask him.  \"Would I? I have been waiting for the\nlast fifteen years for you all to ask me to go on this trip.\" Took him\ntwo minutes to get his stuff, get out and get down there.  We went down\nto the lake.  We have these contests, okay? It's first fish, most fish\nand largest fish, okay? And we have a pool of money for each time we\ndo this, and then while we're out there fishing it's called, you know,\ndollar on the first fish when you're in these little groups fishing in\nthese coves and ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=960.0,1020.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"stuff. Well, some of us have criteria associated with\nwhat you consider a fish.  Others, if it's in the water, it's a fish.\nSo we're fishing.  I'm upstream from my dad and, uh, I catch this\nlittle brim.  And the thing is so small I'm like, I'm not gonna, I'm\nnot gonna do this to the team.  I'm just gonna throw it back in 'cause\nthat's not a fish.  So we're sitting there fishing.  Well, I'm getting\nanother bite, and I'm saying, \"Okay.  Dollar on the first fish.\" He's\ndown in the next boat.  \"I'm not gonna bet.  I'm not into that.  You\ntake my money every time we do this.\" You know.  \"I'm just tired of\ndoing this.\" \"Oh, come on, Dad.  Dollar on the first fish.\" \"Nope.\nNot gonna do it.\" So he sat there for a minute and I said, \"Come on.\"\nI said, \"Dollar on the first fish.\" \"Okay.  If you gonna keep bugging\nme about it, let's do it.  Dollar on the first fish.\" And he holds\nup his pole, \"Got ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1020.0,1080.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"him!\" And it's this little bitty old brim that I'd\nalready thrown back in the water half an hour ago, and he had that\nthing sitting over there hanging off the side of the boat just waiting\nfor me to make this bet.  And we look around and my buddy Nelson says,\n\"That looks like the same fish that you threw over earlier on this\ntrip.\" (laughs) And I looked and I said, \"Dad,\" I said, \"That's the\nfish that I threw overboard, uh, before.\" \"There's nothing in the rule\nabout that.  All you said was who catches the first fish.  It floated\ndown through here, I caught it, I put it on my hook.  You owe me a\ndollar.\"(both laugh) So now you get an idea of the, of the character of\nthis young man we're dealing with over here.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: You didn't say how you, how you caught him; just as long as\nyou brought, caught the first fish.\n \nTROLAND: Now we heard some interesting stories already about the topic\nof fathers.  Let's hear a little bit about your father, uh, Jimmy.  Now\nhe worked here at the, uh, distillery, is that not true?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: He had, he was here fifty-two ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1080.0,1140.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"years and, uh, one of the main\nthings that he--uh, he had a truck.  When I first, when I got out of\nhigh school, I came to work down here driving my daddy's truck, and\nit's just old ton and a half Model 8 truck but what it means we could\nhaul twelve barrels on it.  And that's the way that we'd get the twelve\nbarrels over there for them to dump and go back and get another twelve.\nBut in the meantime, um, he was very particular about the old truck,\nand I had put some extra high sides on it.  And in the--once a year--\nthis was a particular year--he wanted me to go up in the mountains and\nget him a load of coal.  He was burning coal at that time.  And so I\nwent up there and got a load of coal and mounded it over on the old\ntruck, came on back in home and I showed it, parked down there, right\nthere over there, and he came out and looked at ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1140.0,1200.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it and said, \"Oh, boy.\"\nSaid, \"That is a beautiful load of coal.\" He said, \"How much you got\non that, Jim?\" And I said, \"I don't know.  About five or six tons.\" He\njumped up and down and said, \"Don't you never put that much weight on.\"\nI thought he was going to brag, thought he was going to brag on me for\nbringing that big load of coal back.  He jumped right down my throat.\n\"Don't you never put that much coal on my truck no more.\" He said,\n\"It's a wonder the old truck made it in here, but it did.\" But I had to\nput these high racks on it and he said, \"Don't you never put that much\ncoal on it.\" And that's when my feathers fell right quick because--but\nhe was one of the best foremen they had around here at that time.  And,\nuh, in sixty-four, he got ready to retire and, uh, they told me, said,\n\"Jim,\" said, \"You going with your daddy Monday.\" And I said, \"I'm with\nhim every day.\" They said, \"No.\" Said, \"He's gonna teach you everything\nabout being a foreman that he knows.\" I didn't ask to be foreman.  They\nmade me foreman, and I never ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1200.0,1260.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"carried nobody to the office, and nobody\nnever carried me to the office.  From '64 to '78, I was foreman and,\nuh, got along fine with the men.  And lo and behold twenty-five years\nlater, I happened to be over at the Shoney's one day and Zeke Lyle\ncame in--was in there.  And he said, \"Jimmy,\" said, \"If you get here\nFriday, I'll buy you lunch for you.\" I said, \"Okay, I can be here.\"\nAnd I walked in there Friday and there was sixteen of them that had\nworked for me twenty-five years earlier, was waiting to shake my hand\nand just say, \"How you been doing?\" And I said, \"If you guys think that\nmuch after all these years, next year it'll be on me.\" So the next year\nwe went back in that back room of the Shoney's, and we had a ball.  I\nmean we had a good time back there.  Yes, sir.  Just goes to show you\nif you treat a person right, they don't forget it.  That's right.  Yes\nindeed-y.\n \nTROLAND: So your dad, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1260.0,1320.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then, your dad, uh, worked as a foreman here?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Uh-huh.\n \nTROLAND: And, uh, what was, uh, his daily routine like to the extent\nthat you remember that? What did he--\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Oh, he does strictly foreman, what a foreman does; anything\nthat they needed to be done.  But getting--getting way back when he was\na small, when he was young--\n \nF. JOHNSON: He and Colonel Blanton.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: --he and Colonel Blanton played together as boys at was\nsixteen years old--they played together as boys and when Mr.  Blanton\ngot to be the main man down at the distillery, down here, he made Daddy\nforeman.  Like I said, my daddy was one of the first black foremens\nin Kentucky.  Yeah.  Um-hm.  And then later, that's when, later on,\nthat's when they made me foreman.  I didn't ask for it.  They just made\nme foreman.  Said, \"You're going with him.\" And lo and behold, he had\na accident right out here as you drove; where you're driving to the\ndistillery and died from it.  Right there is where he got, got killed.\nThere was a wreck right there. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1320.0,1380.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah.\n \nTROLAND: How old was your dad when he first began working at the\ndistillery?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: I don't have no idea, but he had to be at least twenty or\ntwenty-one years old.\n \nTROLAND: A young man by any means.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah.  Very young.\n \nTROLAND: Yes.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Uh-huh.  Yeah.  He was born in 1897.  Um, was it January?\nYou're February.  He was January.  January of 1897 is when he was born.\nJanuary 12, 1897.  That was Granddad.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: And then you were--I don't think you heard it--but he had\ntwo brothers that worked here, and they, uh, for a long time they were\nfiremen, uh, in the little building right down from the, where we went\nin over there.\n \nF. JOHNSON: The gift shop.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah.  The little building next to that at one time was\nwhere the, uh, power--\n \nF. JOHNSON: Power plant used to be.  Yeah, Blanton's Bottling House used\nto be the power plant for the distillery.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah. They worked in ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1380.0,1440.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there, and one of them, uh, when they\nhauled the whiskey out of here they didn't have no caboose on his car\non the back of it.  And he set, he'd be on the back of the car was a\ngunman until they got up there to the main run where nobody would be,\nsteal the whiskey or break into the car until they got into the main\nline.  That was his job for a while.\n \nTROLAND: Do you ever remember him telling an interesting story about his\ntime here?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Well, no, now I don't think, not that many times that he\ntold me anything about it, but he was just that I knew that he worked\ndown here.  And that was about it.  And see my granddaddy mostly raised\nme, and, uh, and he worked at the cemetery.\n \nTROLAND: Yes.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: So that would--I wouldn't, didn't have too much dealing with\nmy, my father whatsoever.  Uh-huh.\n \nF. JOHNSON: He was, um, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1440.0,1500.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Granddad was, uh, part Irish. He was, like,\nuh--it was kind of interesting how the family came into being here.\nColonel West was actually a plantation owner and, uh, his cook--he\nand his cook were very close, and they had offspring from that.  And\nhe had a son and a daughter, so when, uh, when slavery was abolished\nshe agreed to stay with him and continued traveling with him.  But,\nuh, the agreement was that he would give those two children some land\nhere.  Well, Colonel West was Irish, and so that kind of, like, got\nthis whole thing started.  So a lot of people, the reason that, uh,\nGranddad was successful at being a foreman and traveling with Colonel\nBlanton--because he took him to New York.  They would go up there\non business meetings also--was because he looked more Irish than he\nlooked like an African American.  And that's, you see my dad's hair.\nHe's got ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1500.0,1560.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the--okay. And so when, it's kind of amazing. Granddad's\nhair was even longer and silver.  It was a pretty silver color.  I\nremember it, and it looked like a cross between an Irishman and an\nIndian is what Granddad looked like really.  Okay.  We got a little,\nwe had Indian blood in us also so it was kind of a, a strange mix, but\nthat was how Granddad, uh, was able to, to get into this and to be at\nleast partially accepted.  But uh, he was an exceptional person, uh,\nbusinesswise, uh, and in understanding the distillery business, and\nhe passed a lot of that onto dad.  And, um, to this day I'm amazed\nat my father and his memory and recall at ninety-two years old, um,\nreading the newspaper without glasses, um, still able to get around,\nand you look at that and you look at his longevity and the quality of\nhis life--and, uh, I've shared this with Mark and Angela and them--I\nthink that a lot of ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1560.0,1620.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that is attributed to the fact that he still feels\nvalue added to the community and to this distillery, and that gives\nhim incentive to con-, continue on.  So I, I admire him and my granddad\nand my grandfather on my, uh, on my mother's side simply because even\nthough the hardships were there and even though all the other things\nwent on--and he's shared with me things he went through as a kid, um,\nliving between families and living with grandparents and things like\nthat--um, to maintain his character and to maintain his integrity; uh,\nto him his word is his bond.  Um, those, uh, when I look at kids today\nthat blame their problems in life or society on the fact that their\nparents broke up or their parents divorced or nobody likes them or\nschool didn't treat them right, um, you know, he's an example.  He's\nendured all of that, and so I think character comes from ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1620.0,1680.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"within. You\nknow, you cannot blame that on other people.  It's something that you\nhave inside.  Unless you deal with that, you're no better for society\nthan if you didn't exist.  Okay? So, uh, he has a saying.  It's a song\nthat he likes, and it's, uh, what is it? \"If I Can Help Somebody?\"\n \nJ. JOHNSON: If I can help somebody to travel on, then my living will\nnot be in vain.  And just, that's what I was getting ready to tell you,\nuh, and I can tell you what had happened.  Um, I was sitting up at that\nWalmart yesterday, and a fellow came up to me and said, \"Jimmy, how you\ndoin'?\" He was a very, very close friend of mine.  He came up and said,\n\"Well, how you doing, Jimmy?\" I said, \"I'm doing all right.\" And, uh,\nhe said, \"I seen Freddie down at the distillery the other day.\" And I\nsaid, \"You did?\" And, uh, he said, \"Yeah.\" And I said, \"Well, that's\nmy boy.\" And he like to jumped out of his skin.  He said, \"I never\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1680.0,1740.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"realized that Freddie was any kin to you.\" And he said, \"He is one of\nthe nicest fellows.\" And what I mean, he was just bragging on him, and\nhe said, \"You just wait until I get a chance\"--and he's the man that\nwhen they have the band down here--\n \nF. JOHNSON: Uh-huh.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: --the other guy that plays the bass fiddle.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Yeah.  Birch.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Birch didn't realize you was my son until yesterday.  And he\nsaid, \"You just wait until I see him again.\" So you got a good one--\n \nF. JOHNSON: Oh, my goodness.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: You got a good one coming.  And he said--now he said, I'm\ntelling you in front, telling it right this way--he said you were one\nof the best tour guides that he ever run into.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Thank you.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: That's just, that was his way of saying how much he thought\nof Freddie; said he was one of the best.  And the way he got the job\ndown here was through me. Um, he said, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1740.0,1800.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Dad,\" said, \"I got to have\nsomeplace to go to work because my money's running low.\" I said, \"Well,\ngo down to distillery.  Maybe they'll have something for you to do down\nthere.\" So he came down here.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Now this all started forty years ago.  Here's, part of\nwhat happened here was when I, when I first moved out of here, I was\nactually recruited by AT\u0026T, um, into operations as an, uh, engineer.\nI was a design engineer, and he wanted me to, he always wanted one of\nthe two sons to work at the distillery because it was important for him\nto have this third generation to work here.  Well, my brother went off\nin another direction.  My brother, he's very very, very smart.  He's\nalready logged in as a genius so he's, he's very--\n \nJ. JOHNSON: One way he's very--\n \nF. JOHNSON: All right, now.  We're on camera now.  We're gonna have to\ncut that part out, okay.  All right? (laughs)\n \nF. JOHNSON: But anyway, he's very, very intelligent, but ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1800.0,1860.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Dad says, \"It's\namazing to be so smart.\" Practical things don't, they don't relate to\nhim.  Okay? So it's an interesting mix.  The things that we like to\ndo, my brother is just now in the later years of his life liking to do\nthose kinds of things like going fishing and stuff like that.  Isn't\nthat kind of funny? When you think about that? Daddy's like, \"Yeah.\"\n(laughs)\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah.\n \nF. JOHNSON: So, but, uh, but anyway what happened was this.  Um, when I\nstarted to, when I, uh, was getting ready to move away, he had wanted\nme to work at the distillery.  And when this other job came up, you\nknow, they moved me away from here so I, I stayed on the road for a\nla-long period of time.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah.  Tell them what you were doing on tha-, away from here.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Well, I was, I was doing things.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: (Laughs) He had an office in Atlanta.  You understand that.\nHe had an office in Atlanta and then where was your other ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1860.0,1920.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"office?\n \nF. JOHNSON: You talking about when I was in New Jersey?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Another office in New Jersey now.  (laughs)\n \nF. JOHNSON: Yeah.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: One man who got two offices.  I mean, most people, they have\none.  He had two.  Working with AT\u0026T he had two offices; one in Atlanta\nthen sometimes, a week, several times he'd be up in this other office\nin New Jersey.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Yeah.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: That's kind of moving it around.  You had to be mighty\nimportant to be in two places in the same--in one week\n \nF. JOHNSON: We did, uh, I was involved with a team that did some special\nnetwork designs for AT\u0026T.  Um, it was known as a Star Network, and it\nwas the ability for you to if you called an airline to make your flight\nreservation, uh, we had a way of getting the machine to reprocess that\ncall so that, uh, it would crank back and then it would hook you right\nup to the car rental agency that you needed to go to and it would crank\nback from there and carry you right to the, uh, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1920.0,1980.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"hotel that you wanted\nto make a reservation with.  So you wouldn't have to dial a whole bunch\nof different numbers.  You just dial one number and they just say,\n\"well, do you need a car? Well, fine.  We'll just hook you up.\" And all\nthat person would have to do is hit a prompt button, and it would send\nyou to National or to, uh, to Hertz or to wherever you wanted to go.\nSo it was a neat little--we got, we got some real nice recognition for\nthat.  Uh, I worked in underground military sites.  I used to, part of\nmy responsibility was tracking Air Force One, uh, when the president\nwas flying around.  Um, we were, we were down in atomic bomb shelters\nthree or four stories underneath the ground.  So I've had, I had, um,\nassignments, uh, Puerto Rico and the Virgin Islands, um, as operations\nmanager and network engineering.  So it's, it's been a very nice career\nthat I've had; uh, fiber optics and things like that.  So when I came\nback to Kentucky, I'm here and I'm taking care of Dad.  I was running\nback and forth ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1980.0,2040.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from Georgia to come up here, and so we moved back up\nhere and, uh, we're piddling around.  And we go out to eat every now\nand then, and so I told him about I was looking for something to do\nand everything.  And well he points up to the water tower, and he said,\n\"Well, have you thought anymore about it?\" And I said, \"About what?\"\nAnd he said, \"Well, you know that promise you made to me that if you\never came back to Frankfort that you'd work down at the distillery\nfor a little while so that we could tell everybody we had three direct\ngenerations to work here.\" And I'm thinking, \"You're setting me up here\nnow.  Something's going on.\" Right? So I said, \"Dad, I made you the\npromise.\" I said, \"I'll keep it.\" He says, \"Good.  I've already told\nthem that you're back in town.  Meet me down there Monday morning at\nnine o'clock.  I think we've found something that you could do.\" Tour\nguide, okay, and that started.  Now the timing, what's really funny\nabout all this, it's how all this stuff came back. I'd been ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2040.0,2100.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"coming\ndown to this distillery between my dad and my granddad since I was\nabout five years old and we used to go behind the river.  Okay? I was\nfascinated with the dry house, with, uh, with the boxcars and re-gauge\nand all this stuff.  All that stuff amazed me and it was like--but it\nwas one of those things that you couldn't play around too much because\nit was dangerous, okay, with those big 550 pound barrels.  Um, but just\nfrom, just from then, all these things that he and my grandfather had\ntalked about, um, the stories that they'd shared, um, aging, um, some\nof the subtle things that a lot of people that, like, I'm sure Ronnie\nand Leonard probably talked about, um, they just, they were just there.\nAnd you come back and you start walking through those old warehouses\nand some of the stories and things that they shared with you comes\nback, and you can just get images of them walking through the warehouse\nlooking at the barrels, uh, looking for ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2100.0,2160.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"leaks, okay. Looking at where\nthe barrel is sitting and looking at how it's coming along and, uh, it\nmakes you appreciate, uh, the art that was associated with, with real\nbourbon and whiskey making.  Yeah, it was quite an art.\n \nTROLAND: Is there a particular story that you remember for example\nthat your grandfather told you, uh, or that you experienced under his\nsupervision when you were a kid that you can remember?\n \nF. JOHNSON: Um, the only one I remember is trying to find a leaky barrel,\nokay, and, uh, that, uh, I thought a leaky barrel was the whiskey,\nlike, knocking over a bottle or something like that and just glug glug\nglug (gurgling sound) just gurgling out right? Well, a leaky barrel\nfor them is where the whiskey is seeping through the wood a little\nbit too much, but it doesn't taste like the bourbon when it's finally\nprocessed. So the leaky barrel you've got, uh, got the ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2160.0,2220.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"char, you've\ngot some of the old green oak, you've got dirt and grit and everything\nelse, so my first encounter with a leaky barrel I thought it was just\ngoing to be just as good as anything you could ever put in your mouth.\nIt was some of the worst tasting stuff I have ever experienced, but\nI'd heard them talking about leaky barrels.  \"Oh, the leaky barrel, the\nleaky barrel.\" And I got hold of the stuff, and I was just heartbroken\nas a kid.  That was the worst tasting stuff I'd ever put in my mouth.\nOh, Lordy.  Um, but no, I, I listened to their stories.  The one that\nfascinated me the most was the one that when they told--Granddad told\nthem not to put all those barrels on one side of Warehouse C, and they\nwouldn't listen to him.  They were trying to make room for some new\nbarrels of whiskey coming in, and he told them not to do it.  And they\nsaid, We want you to do it anyway, and he says, \"I'm telling you, this\nis not what you want to do.  You don't want to move those barrels over\nthere.\" And they told him that if he didn't do ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2220.0,2280.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it, they was going to\nget somebody else to do it.  So that was on, what, Sunday morning that\nthey made him move all these barrels over there, and he warned them\nthat that was, was going to be bad.  And by that evening--\n \nJ. JOHNSON: He hadn't got them, he had not got them hadn't got too far\nfrom the warehouse-\n \nF. JOHNSON: --the whole thing shifted and the whole wall fell out on the\nback side of that warehouse.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Um-hm.\n \nF. JOHNSON: The, uh, these old warehouses, what a lot of folks didn't\nunderstand was the construction of them, which they did, and the\nwooden structure on these older warehouses are a completely separate\nentity than the brick shell on the outside.  And they're held together\nbasically just like a--think of in a tobacco barn or something like\nthat.  So these ricks are just wooden pylons that go down to the\nlimestone bedrock, and they're held together with bolts and nails is\nall it is. And if you get the weight, um, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2280.0,2340.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"unevenly distributed, the\nwhole thing will shift, and that's what happened.  So they've got\nplum bobs now throughout these old warehouses, uh, to prevent that\nfrom happening, but that's what happened.  And so the only way you can\nfix that once it happens, you've got to take all the barrels out and\nrealign the whole thing and start all over again.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: And, and you'll see, uh, things about that big around in the\nwall--\n \nF. JOHNSON: Those big plates.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: --big plates on the, on the wall up and down through there,\nand the plates run all the way connected to the other wall and hold it.\n \nF. JOHNSON: The cables.  They have cables that holds the shell in place,\nand then the ricks have plum bobs so that they stay aligned.  So, yeah.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah.  They had just, hadn't got three or four from the\nthing when it fell just on a Sunday evening.\n \nTROLAND: How old were you Freddie at the time this incident occurred?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: No, no.\n \nF. JOHNSON: That was before me.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: That was way before.\n \nTROLAND: Oh, this is before.\n \nF. JOHNSON: No, that was Dad, that was when Dad was here.\n \nTROLAND: Oh, I see.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: No. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2340.0,2400.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"My dad was here.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Yeah.  Granddaddy was here.  You were, I was trying to\nthink.  That would have been nineteen--that warehouse goes back to 1881\nand, uh, that happened in the nineteen, that happened in the nineteen\nhundreds, though.  About nineteen fif--\n \nTROLAND: What's your earliest memory, Freddie, uh, of coming to the site\nand with whom did you come to the site? Your grandfather, your father\nor both?\n \nF. JOHNSON: Um, the first-, actually were we, we were on a, first time\nwe came down here were we getting grain doors?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: We've gotten grain doors down here.  I could have gotten\nslop for the pig.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Yep.  So--\n \nJ. JOHNSON: You see at one time they'd hold slop five cents a barrel for\nthe pig.  You could come down here and get it.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Um-hm.  A barrel.  And so that and the grain doors, and that\nwould have put me right at about five years old.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: But see we got the grain doors and made a big shed out in\nthe back yard, out of those grain doors.  They would sell them to you-\n-they were just like, nothing but a big slab or wood is all they were--\nbut you could get them for ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2400.0,2460.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"reasonable and that's what I--I had a truck,\nold pickup truck that could haul them, so that's what we built it with.\n \nF. JOHNSON: And we used that to form the--to make forms to pour the\nfoundation for part of our home.  So that was the first time we came\ndown here and then, uh, was doing that and then we would fish over\nbehind the river and I was about, I guess, I was about four or five\nyears old when I was fishing back over there when you would bring us\ndown there.  And, uh, I would uh, go up the--you could come in through\narea and then you would go down by the dry house to go down the side of\nthe riverbank to fish and, uh, I can just remember us--I was about four\nor five years old when I first started getting to come down here.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: I tell you one thing, though, I saved them, the little\nrascals one night.  We were down near, down to--\n \nF. JOHNSON: When you saved us?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah.\n \nF. JOHNSON: You put us in that mess, too.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: (laughs) It was two big old pipe--\n \nF. JOHNSON: Culverts.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2460.0,2520.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"--culverts goes across the road down there, and there was\na rain coming up.  Heard that there was a storm coming up, and we\nran up there and got in the culverts and, oh, it was nice.  They were\njust running up and down through this big old tube, big pipe, and all\nit once it hit me that the water up on top of that hill has got to\ncome down through these pipes.  And you talk about getting two little\nfellows out of that pipe in a hurry.  We hurried up and got them out\nof that pipe and got around the side there a little bit and all at once\nhere came this big thing of water coming right on down through there.\n \nF. JOHNSON: It was like a flash flood, and it would start off as just\na little trickle.  And he looked and he got this look on his face, and\nhe says, \"Let's go.  Get out of here now.  Come on here.\" And we'd just\ngotten away from that when all the water come down off the side of the\nmountain.  And it would have washed us right on out.  We probably would\nhave been killed.  It would have washed us right on out into the middle\nof the ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2520.0,2580.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"river. But yeah, it's, we had some fun times.\n \nTROLAND: It's interesting, Freddie, you've had two grandfathers both of\nwhom were in the whiskey business.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Basically.  (laughs)\n \nTROLAND: Different aspects of the whiskey business.  How do these two\nmen compare?\n \nF. JOHNSON: Um, that's kind of interesting.  Uh, Papa Strong--\n \nTROLAND: That's how he really made his money.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Yeah.  Yeah.  He, he did the coal, but the moonshine\nbasically got him through, um, and back up in the mountains, uh,\nthey, they did it.  They had their own way of moving it around, uh,\nand they pretty much kept us shielded from that.  Uh, my grandmother\nwas very religious, and she didn't drink at all.  And so that part of\nthe business was not allowed in the house, so he did that outside the\nhouse. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2580.0,2640.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Uh, no business was transacted in the house or in front of\nany of us.  Okay, so we would just know people would come and go and\nbottles would appear and bottles would disappear, and we never, we knew\nnot to mess with it.  Okay, but, um, in the mountain area, um, the two\nthings that were true--I guess that were consistent--was your word.\nSo up in the mountains, those folks, your word was your bond.  In the\nwhiskey business, your word was your bond.  Integrity has always been a\nbig part of, uh, of the bourbon and the whiskey industry.  Integrity is\nkey.  Um, that's one of the reasons they went to bottling bourbon was\nbecause they were taking your whiskey, and if I bought a barrel from\nyou I'd take your premium bourbon and get somebody's cheap bourbon and\nmix it together but I'd sell it under your name.  And then you'd get\na chance to--you'd get word back that your whiskey wasn't tasting as\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2640.0,2700.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"good as it used to, and you'd find out that this middle person had been\ncutting your whiskey down and mixing it with other stuff.  So integrity\nhas always been a critical part of this whole process and, uh, that's\nsomething I learned from both of them.  So they were--and they were\nrigid.  I mean, they were hard, but they were fair.  Um, and my dad\nwas the same way.  I mean, you know, I guess probably some of the\nworst whippings I've ever gotten was, uh, probably well-deserved, but I\ndidn't think so at the time.  (laughs) Um, but, um, it wasn't really--\n \nJ. JOHNSON: How about you creeping out of the basement?\n \nF. JOHNSON: Oh, yeah.  Yeah.  Well, that one, that one hurt, too.\n(laughs) Uh, actually we were supposed to have gone to bed, and my\nbrother had just reached that point in adolescence where, uh, you\nchallenge the system. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2700.0,2760.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So my dad told us to go to bed. Well, my bed\nwas nearest to the door, and my brother's bed was on the other side\nof the room.  And so my dad had hollered in the door and told us to,\nuh, to cut out the noise and go to bed.  And so my brother started\nmocking my dad and laughing and said, \"Who does he think he is, you\nknow, acting like he runs this house,\" and all this stuff.  Well, I'm\nlaughing while my back is to the door.  Well, the next thing I know,\nI'm seeing stars and he's knocked me underneath the bed, and my brother\ngrabs the covers and covers himself up real quick and protects himself\nso my dad can't get to him.  So my brother thought it was funny, but\nwhat I learned from that, it was, like, Okay.  Everybody that, that\nmakes you laugh is not necessarily your friend.  (laughs) So, uh, uh,\nbut, uh, it was, like--it was never, we never considered it abuse.  It\nwas, like, usually when we ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2760.0,2820.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"did something and we were disciplined for\nit, we knew we, we knew we'd really messed up.  Um, my mother was the\nintellect in the group.  She used this process of, uh, when you did\nsomething wrong, she would let you go get your own switch.  Okay, so\nyou'd go out and cut the switch based on what you thought the severity\nof the wrongdoing was.  So my brother told me, says, \"I've got this one\nknocked.\" He says, \"Let just go out and get a couple of little twigs.\"\nHe says, \"We'll bring them back, and let's see if she's really going to\nhold true to her word.\" So she comes back, we come back with these two\nlittle twigs and she looks at us and she says, \"Now,\" she says, \"that's\nwhat you want me to whip you with?\" We said, \"Yes.\" She says, \"Now,\nyou see, that's the difference between you and mom.\" She says, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2820.0,2880.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Now\nI'm gonna whip you with your switch.\" So she hit us three or four times\nand those little things fell apart, and me and my brother look at each\nother.  My brother's starting to laugh.  And she said, \"Now you see,\nthis is why we're here.\" She said, \"You see, that's how bad you thought\nthis was.\" And she reaches behind her and pulls out this big switch,\nshe said, \"Now, this is how bad mother thinks it is.\"--(laughs)--and\nshe began to whip us.  And she says, \"If you think that's bad,\" she\nsaid, \"wait till your father gets home.\" Well, whenever those words\ncame out, we knew we had really messed up bad, um, but it was a, it was\na balance, okay.  It was a balance between the two of them, and I think\nthat, that's what's important about this.  Uh, to see the different\ngenerations and be able to go visit--you know, you're living with your\nparents.  You go visit your grandparents in different surroundings.\nYou see how they're living, and you get to spend summers with them.\nSo you're riding on horses, your riding, you know, out in the fields,\nyou're, you know, you're taking care of the gardens.  You're doing all\nthese things that you can ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2880.0,2940.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"just have fun. You know, you've got your\nbuddies there with you.  You'd take a tomato.  I mean, there's nothing\nmore irritating than getting hit upside the head with a hot, wet, juicy\ntomato, okay.  But it was, I mean, there were fun things that really\ndidn't hurt you.  We'd go up on the farm at Kentucky State and we'd\nhelp them harvest, you know, bring in the hay and the grains in the\nsilos and take care of the cows and stuff, and it was just, it was just\nfun, okay.  Um, and it, I, to me, I think it made us better adults.\nOkay, we just had a balanced life, so--\n \nJ. JOHNSON: You remember the night, that evening that you all were down\nin the basement skulking and I came through and told you not to--to\nstop that skulking? Huh? You remember that night?\n \nF. JOHNSON: Uh-huh.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: I just walked through and casually told them, \"You know,\nboys, had enough of that tearing up your clothes.\" So I said, \"Stop\nthat skulking.\" Then I just walked right on out and shut the door, and\nI had no more than shut the door ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=2940.0,3000.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"until, Lord, it started all over again\nwith the boom boom.  And I come right back through that door and I hit\nboth of them at the same time, and I like to tore their heads off and\nI went right on through.  And so I said, \"Well, I told you not to do\nit no more.\" And I just kept on walking, and they said years after that\none of them said to the other one, said, \"One of us can't whup him,\nbut maybe both of us, maybe both of us could.\" Good Lord.  And he said,\n\"No.\" Said, \"Dad's been moving too many of them big heavy barrels down\nthere.  We'll just forget the whole thing.\" (laughs) Yes, sir.  Yes,\nI just casually told them to stop, stop their skulking, wasn't nothing\nbut tearing their clothes up.  They went right on back, just as soon as\nI turned my back, they went right on back to the same thing, but that,\nthey changed their mind when I came back through there.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Here's something that was amazing about that, time.  Uh, um,\nwhat we learned from, uh, our ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3000.0,3060.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"grandparents--their recall. Uh, at that\ntime they had probably 200,000 barrels of whiskey around here.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Uh-huh.\n \nF. JOHNSON: They remembered those barrels, the placement, the ricks,\nuh, where they were sitting, how they were aging, uh, their numbers-\n-because everything was done by numbers--um, to this day, he's got\nuh, a literature book that he, uh, that he just recited and this lady\ndocumented.  It's a prose of, uh, of English literature, and he still\nrecites all this stuff.  Uh, numbers, he can click down through numbers\nand, you know, we were looking at him and he says, \"Well, that's just\nthe way you do it.\" And, and, uh, my grandfather was the same way, and\nit's just something about, uh, a knack for doing those ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3060.0,3120.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"kinds of things\nand doing sequencing and things like that, and they just developed a\nrhythm or a pattern.  And they knew about, um, the right times to age\nthe bourbon, which warehouses to put it in, which grains to use.  Okay,\nwhat, you know, when those, when those grains come in and you make\ncertain kinds of whiskey, where to place them in the warehouse and what\nthat whiskey's going to taste like after so many years, and they'll\ntell you whether it's aging too fast or aging too slow.  Um--\n \nJ. JOHNSON: A lot of days, lot of times they'll just transfer a whole\nfloor of whiskey on up in the house to let it age faster and things\nlike that.  The lower floor, the lower floors had to be moved up\nbecause they wasn't aging fast enough down here, and when you got ready\nto put it in the bottle, it was just tinted.  Instead of being nice and\nbrown, it was just a weak tint.  You understand what I'm saying? But\nwhen you put it on that top floor, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3120.0,3180.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you start getting that heat to it,\nthen it turns just like it's supposed to be, and the color comes back\nto it.  Um-hm.\n \nTROLAND: Jimmy, let's go back, uh, a little while in time here to\nwhen you were a young adult and just before you came to work here at\nthe distillery.  What, uh, uh, what brought you to the distillery?\nObviously your father had worked there.  Was it, did you always imagine\nyou'd work here or what thoughts did you have in those days?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Well, uh, I finished high school in '36, and he got me a job\ndown here of driving his truck.  But now it wasn't hauling but twelve\nbarrels at a time, but my cousin and I finished at the same year and\nthen both of us got--his brother's, my father's brother and his son--\n \nF. JOHNSON: Benny.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: --Benny, got a job down here at the same time, and he worked\nin the cistern remover where they dumped the barrels.  And he was the\none who sent the whiskey on over to the bottling house through those\npipes. That was his job ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3180.0,3240.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"over there, and so, and then, uh, later on\nafter I work-drove the truck for a while, then the next thing you know,\nwhy, Mr.  Blanton wanted somebody to help, uh, uh, patch the barrels.\nThat paid more money, and that's what I liked because it seemed at\nthe least off it was like another step up.  So I quit driving the truck\nand start patching barrels, and, uh, Mr., Mr.  Smith didn't think too\nmuch of that because he wanted his leak hunters to be the ones that\ndid most of the, of the work like that.  And he'd go down there and\ntell Mr.  Blanton that \"Down there the whiskey's leaking pretty bad.\nYou need some more leak hunters.\" And the first thing you know, well,\nthey had twenty-three leak hunters around here.  That's a great big\nbunch of men, and finally Mr.  Blanton finally looked through it to\nsee what was happening.  He was just getting his buddies on this high\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3240.0,3300.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"job. And so lo and behold, Mr. Blanton told them, told everybody,\nsaid, \"Go through the warehouses, you know, leaks, to get the leaks\nout.  Go through the warehouses and pick out the worst barrel that\nthey can find and bring them over there and put them high on the\nbottom floor.\" And that's what they did, and there were about twenty\nbarrels that were just horrible to work on that John Redken and I had\nto fix.  And it took us about two days to fix those barrels and put\nsome type of a black paste of stuff (??) on the face.  After we sewed\nit up with pegs and got the pegs drove in, then we were supposed to\nput this black paste over it, then that would seal the whole thing.\nAnd on this particular day we had just got through putting the black\nseal on them, and I was up in the warehouse closing the windows and I\ncould hear whiskey running. And I ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3300.0,3360.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"came downstairs and I'm going to say\nit like this, somebody had turned every one of those barrels over to\nwhere the bad spot was down on the floor.  And a lot of the whiskey,\nwhere the pegs hadn't sealed good, was running whiskey right down on\nthe floor and I turned them all back up and told, went over there and\ntold Utterback what had happened, and he told Mr.  Blanton.  And a day\nor two after that, Mr.  Blanton let Mr.  Smith know that he was going\nto have to get rid of some of those leak hunters because he said it\nwasn't nothing but just pouring money down the rat hole as we said.  It\nwas just pouring money down the rat hole.  Said, \"I might as well have\nthe whiskey running out to be paying all of these men extra money and\nthen not fixing the barrels to begin with.\" They got to be pretty rough\nabout that.  And a little later on--(microphone drops).\n \nF. JOHNSON: That didn't work out too well.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3360.0,3420.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Uh-oh. I'm glad it was yours instead of mine cause--(laughs)\n \n \n[Pause in recording.]\n \n \nHAY: We're rolling again.\n \nTROLAND: Okay.  This is, uh, tape number two.  My name is Tom Troland.\nWe're interviewing Freddie Johnson and Jimmy Johnson here at Buffalo\nTrace Distillery.  It is, uh, October 16, 2008.\n \nHAY: I'm just going to pause you.\n \n \n[Pause in recording.]\n \n \nHAY: Okay.  We're rolling.\n \nTROLAND: So let's see if I understand this correctly, Jimmy.  You began\nwork here at the distillery, uh, driving a truck and then later spent\ntime, uh, repairing barrels.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Repairing barrels.\n \nTROLAND: How old were you when you first came to work here?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: I don't have no idea.  I don't know--have no idea.\n \nTROLAND: Young man, though?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: But yes, a young man; out of high school.  Eighteen,\neighteen, I was eighteen anyway.  And I had to be old enough to, to\nwork down here.\n \nF. JOHNSON: And to drive.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah (Freddie laughs).  But anyhow, that's the way it\nstarted out and then, uh, later on I got ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3420.0,3480.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/59","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ready to go into the service\nand, uh, but I just finished high school.  That's just as far as I\ngot, but I started working down here, but my cousin that finished in\nthe high school the same time I did, he went on to college, and, uh,\nlo and behold we went in the army at the same time.  And whatever\nJack put down on his paper--now he'd be--he'd been to college now--and\nwhatever he put down on his paper, me finishing high school, I just\nput that down on whatever he put down.  And I ended up, when they get\nready to grade it they've just got a great big sheet of a thing that\nthey just put over the, your paper, and that would tell you what kind\nof education that you have.  And it showed me with a, as a high school\ngraduate, with a college, a college degree 'cause I had chocked, took\neverything that he had on his paper and put it on mine.  And then\nthey sent me--we went ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3480.0,3540.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/60","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"into the service together--and they sent us to\nSnoopfield, Illinois to work on airplane wings.  If I'd been working\non them wings they'd still be fly, flying back from somewhere.  But\nwe stayed with that for about six weeks and didn't have another detail\nbut, but one, and that was p-, when the chimneys started blowing over.\nAnd they gave us a detail of, uh, watching the chimneys, and I walked\nout the door and looked, and my chimney was falling over.  And I came\nback and told him, he said, \"That, that's the end of it.\" But yet,\nstill while I was getting back to, the whole time--I was in the service\nfor five years--and the whole time I was in the service, the company\ngave me a week's wages every month.  For the whole time I was in the\nservice, I drew a week's wages from the company and on holidays--\nthey've got companies all over the--offices all over the United States.\nThe company has got offices all over the United States--and they go,\nwent around and took up a collection and, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3540.0,3600.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/61","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"uh, the last one I got on\nGuam was for $300 on Christmas Day.  Um-hm.  That's just, that's just\nthe way the company took out, took care of us.\n \nTROLAND: Now you knew, uh, Colonel Blanton who played such a major role\nin this, uh, distillery in the early part of the twentieth century.\nWhat, uh, what are your recollections of Colonel Blanton?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: One of the fairest people that I've ever known.  That's my\nversion of Mr.  Blanton.  Um-hm.  Yes, sir.  Uh, I took a, what is it?\nThe mumps where your throat swells up?\n \nF. JOHNSON: Uh-huh.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: I had the mumps once, and when I got over the mumps, well,\nthe doctor told me, said, \"You could go back to work, but you can just\ndo light duty when you first get back.\" And I came down here and told\nMr.  Orville, said \"I'm back but I can't' do anything but just light\nduty,\" and ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3600.0,3660.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/62","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they let me know real quick, \"You'll do whatever we tell you\nto do just like the rest of them.\" And Dad went and told Mr.  Blanton\nwhat he said, what, uh, they said.  And he sent word back up there,\nsaid, \"The doctor told him to do light duty.  You'd better find him\nsome light duty.\" And it wasn't too long until I was closing windows\nand things like that, you understand what I mean, because that's the\nkind of fellow he was.  He tried to be fair any way he could, in any\nway, and then, on one day down, we was fishing down by the river, and\nDad caught a nice bass just about that long.  And I said, \"Oh, boy.\" I\nsaid, \"We can really have a fish dinner now, can't we?\" Dad said, \"No.\"\nHe said, \"Mr.  Blanton can have a nice fish dinner.\" And he cleaned\nthat fish that evening and brought us right on up here and gave it to\nMr.  Blanton.  He said, \"Now we can eat them others we caught, but it's\njust Mr.  Blanton's going to get this one.\" That's just the way the\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3660.0,3720.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/63","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"guy, he and dad--Mr. Blanton were just that close--\n \nF. JOHNSON: They were close.  They were close.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yep, so there.  But yet still, there were several little\nthings that happened, and he would take up for the men right quick.\nAnd he, if he liked you, you were just his, on his side of the thing.\nAnd another case was a fellow by the name of Creedin Creen lived\nup the street here, and he had, I think, about twelve kids--(Freddie\nlaughs)--and, uh, for some reason Mr.  Blanton told, they fired him\nthat evening on Friday evening, and Monday morning Creedin was right\nback down here to work what--what he'd, he'd been doing all the time.\nAnd Mr.  Blanton said, \"Didn't I fire you Friday?\" And he said,\n\"Albert, I've got twelve kids, and I got to work somewhere and it just\nmight as well be down here.\" Now Mr.  Blanton done fired him on Friday,\nand he said, \"I got them ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3720.0,3780.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/64","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"twelve kids to feed, and I might as well work\ndown here.\" And Mr.  Blanton told him to go on and work but \"just be\ncareful what you do from now on,\" and Creedin worked down here until he\nretired.  That's just the kind of fellow he was.  Very nice.\n \nTROLAND: Did you know him personally? Did you have a chance to speak to\nhim from time to time personally--\n \nJ. JOHNSON: I spoke to him several times.\n \nTROLAND: --and if so, what were your impressions?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Very good.  Very nice man.  He and I got along fine.  Um-hm.\nYeah.  No complaint about Mr.  Blanton.  He called me Jim.  \"Jim.\"\nHe'd holler \"Jim,\" and that would be the end of it.  And that, that\nstone, uh, statue of him out there, if you're around here during the,\nChrist-- uh, Christmas, um, the wintertime when the snow's on the\nground and snow's getting on it, it looks like that where the snow is\nstacked up on it, it looks like he's holding his--he's real comical\nto look at, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3780.0,3840.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/65","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if you get a chance to look at it when the snow's on the\nground.  Yeah, he looks like he just holding them up and brought his\nhead down in his, between his shoulders is the way he looks, but he was\nas fine a fellow as you want to be bothered with, and I'm saying fair\nall the way through.  Um-hm.\n \nTROLAND: Now you began working here, uh, as I understand it just a few\nyears after the end of Prohibition?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yes.\n \nTROLAND: And you, uh, have been part of the rolling out of each\nmillionth barrel since, uh, after Prohibition?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah.\n \nTROLAND: Uh, what is your recollection of the first roll out? When\nroughly was that? Was that very shortly after you began working here?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: It wasn't too long after that, and see they had to--those\nbarrels most time was in the I Warehouse on the bottom floor in Rick\nSix and, uh, just one barrel back in there, and they would bring\nvisitors would come in there, and they'd carry them down there and\nshow them where, show them the whatever millionth barrel it was, and\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3840.0,3900.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/66","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then finally they built the little one-barrel warehouse, and that's,\nand that's when they put it--put it in that place over there.  Um-hm,\nthat's the way that went.  And, uh, see at one time, the highway ran\nright through the distillery.  It hasn't always been, uh, closed on the\nother end.  At--uh, at any time of night, you're just liable to have a\nbunch of people going through here going home, but--but now, the road\ngoes out around that way and in, in back around behind the distillery,\nthey cut that off 'cause they put the gates through there.  Um-hm.\n \nTROLAND: Is there a story that you remember from one of those barrel-\nrolling incidents that particularly, uh, sticks in your mind?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: One in particular that, uh, I was very fortunate to be there\nwhen it happened, uh, a fellow by the name of Flappey, Curtis Flappey,\nwas working ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3900.0,3960.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/67","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in O--in N. He was working in N--and, uh, Tubby was back\nin the rick, and there--there wasn't but one or two barrels back in\nthere.  He was, he was back in there by himself running them through,\nand uh, those-- for some reason as those slats went down--I was just\ncoming across-- happened to be coming through there--and Flappey was\ngoing down with a barrel, and I could hear another barrel rolling along\nthe old, the rail (??).  I could hear another barrel rolling and, \"Wait\na minute.  The barrel's rolling.\" And Flappey's on his way down with\nhis head down like this, and I ran there, ran up that and caught the\nbarrel.  Now just, somehow or another in my arm the Lord give me enough\nstrength to stop that barrel on the fourth rick just as it was about to\nroll down.\n \nF. JOHNSON: It would have crushed him.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: It would ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=3960.0,4020.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/68","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have crushed him because it was already down like\nI said, and all it would have to do just--one of them three or four\nhundred pound barrels coming out of that rick--and, uh, it would have\ncrushed him.  But I just had enough strength to stop it just as it\ngot right at the edge of the, of the rick, and it was one of the most\nhorrible things that I, that I ever ran into while I was down here.  And\nTubby was way back in there, and he thought he was coming up.  He got\nconfused, and he thought he was coming up on the elevator, on the rick\nand he was going down.  See that puts the barrel, him in the middle of\ntwo barrels, and it just, would have just crushed him.  You see?\n \nF. JOHNSON: Uh-huh.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: And another time that I had, I had to, uh, show you how\ncrazy I was.  Uh, one of my men--I won't call the name--but anyhow\nhe was my rick machine operator that, that evening.  And we was-- he\nwas ricking in the six ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4020.0,4080.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/69","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"tier back there, and he was so drunk, I was\nexpecting him to fall off the, uh, rick machine at any time carrying\nthese barrels up, kicking them off and come back to get another one.\nAnd he was so drunk until he couldn't hardly stand on the thing, and\nthere I was down under the rick, understand, under the rick machine\nlooking up in case he fell.  I was going to try to catch him.  (laughs)\nI, though, later on, I realized how, how stupid that was.  If he fell\noff and that barrel, too, there wouldn't be nothing left of me but just\na squash in the floor.  But we got by with it.  He was the only rick\nmachine man I had that day, and that got us two-thirds in the wind.\n \nTROLAND: After World War II, uh, you came back to the distillery.  Um,\nwhat were your duties at that time immediately after World War II\nworking here?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: I was patching. That's when I was patching the ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4080.0,4140.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/70","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"barrels.\nUm-hm.  Yeah, and it wasn't too long after that, well, in '64, that's\nwhen I took over as a foreman.  Uh-huh.\n \nTROLAND: And so how did your duties change once you became a foreman?\nWhat was the difference between it?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Most of the time they left me a new whiskey gang.  That was,\nmost of the year when they were making whiskey, just-- about three or\nfour months out of the year--three months out of the year--that they\ndon't make whiskey, and yet still I'd be doing other jobs.  But once\nthe whiskey started right back up, then I was right in there with the\nnew whiskey.  It was a real nice thing to know because you got to the\npoint where you knew what you were going to be doing every day, and\nyou wasn't confused about getting--going over there and getting a few\nbarrels out here, uh, bringing a bunch in to dump or something like\nthat, this was just-- well, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4140.0,4200.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/71","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"booked it, you see? You put it down and\nthen, you've got, you've got-- as Freddie said, a lot of times they\nwould have a lost barrel; where maybe the rick machine or the truck\ndriver dropped it off at the wrong house or something like that.  And\nthey would give you a number to look forward to, to, to, to see if\nyou ran across that barrel.  You could tell them where it was and then\nthey could come get it and dump it because it was supposed to be in\nthis dump, but it wasn't in that area where it was supposed to be.  And\nmaybe, sometimes it'd be a month or two we'd run upon a barrel that'd\nbe either in the wrong house or just setting in some, out of place and\ncome tell them where it was, and they'd come get it and dump it.\n \nTROLAND: What, uh, happened on a typical day during that time after you\nhad become the foreman in, uh, 1964, you said? Uh, what was a typical\nday like ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4200.0,4260.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/72","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"here at the distillery for you?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Well, you knew, you knew your men and we all got along fine,\nand then just as I say, they knew that, what their job was and they\njust went on and did it.  And, uh, as I say, I never had to carry a man\nto the office, and nobody never carried me to the office.\n \nF. JOHNSON: But you'd, you'd pick up your work order for the day that\ntells you which barrels needed to be pulled out.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Oh, yeah, something like that.  You'd go to the office and\nget those.  You'd have this big sheet of paper there with all of the\nricks and, and, uh, how many barrels were, you know, are going to be in\nsuch an area.  But the numbers were on the barrels so you'd know which\nones to get out and which ones to leave.\n \nTROLAND: Now I once saw an ad for Jack Daniels whiskey, and it showed\npictures of several gentlemen sitting on rocking chairs in the rick\nhouse.  And the ad copy said that they just sat there, uh, and did\nnothing all day long while the whiskey aged. Is ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4260.0,4320.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/73","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that what you, uh,\nexperienced when you were working here?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Well shit no.  Well no, you'd just--no.\n \nF. JOHNSON: (laughs)\n \nJ. JOHNSON: First day, you know, John Gross went through, uh, and\nchecked the whiskey to make sure it was there.  All right, and then,\nhere you come by with a bunch of men, and you get that whiskey out\nand carry it downstairs and they bring it over to the re-gauge room\nto dump.  We didn't have to worry about it.  Once we got it out of the\nrick and on that truck, we was through with it and that was the end of\nthat, that barrel.  And then, you know, uh, sometimes you'd just have\nto go way back in there in the rick to get a barrel where they'd put\nit back there by mistake or something like that.  But as a rule, we got\nalong fine.  We got along pretty good.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Usually when they were making whiskey, the, uh, in the, uh,\nin the morning they would be filling the barrels. And while ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4320.0,4380.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/74","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they were\nfilling the barrels, you'd have your order for the ones that needed to\ncome out of the warehouse, and so you'd bring those barrels out while\nthey were filling the other barrels.  And then in the afternoon or the\nevening you would then put the new barrels into the warehouse.  A lot\nof times you was making space by bringing those other barrels out, so\nit was kind of like you had a, usually had a schedule set up of barrels\ncoming in--what they call new entry--barrels coming in and barrels going\nout.  And it was like, it was just like a production line, so you know,\nyou were making space and filling that space basically in the same day.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah, but when you're running six sixty it was solid all day\nlong, we didn't have enough time to get nothing out.  It was six sixty\nis what they run for years around here, and it was very few days that\nwe didn't get that whiskey up with sixteen men.\n \nTROLAND: So you supervised a group of sixteen.  Is that correct?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Uh-huh.  Yup, just as long as I run sixteen, sixteen man\ngang, to see that they got in the rail. And see a lot of times we ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4380.0,4440.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/75","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"had\nto haul it way over in the fields with two trucks.  We had two trucks\nrunning to get it over there in the fields, and we had to rick it as\nfast as those two trucks could bring it.  That would hold the whole\nwall, the whole thing up, see, and everything would usually run pretty\nsmooth all the way through.  Now every now and then we'd get a new\nman in the gang, and I'd tell him, I said, \"Now your job is to roll\nthe barrel from there up to there.  That's your job.  Keep the barrel\ncoming off the truck.\" And I'd go around the corner or something like\nthat, and wouldn't be too long until you'd hear the doggonest racket\naround there, and the man says, \"What are you talking about? What's\nwrong with you? What'd he tell you to do?\" \"He says to roll it from\nthere up to there, but he's gone now so I'm gonna--\" \"You're gonna roll\nthat barrel up there because if, when you stop it there, then I've got\nto come back and pick it up and carry it ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4440.0,4500.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/76","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on up there to where you were\nsupposed to be putting it to begin with.\" And you'd hear one of the\ndoggonest rackets around here, and I'm sitting around there listening,\nnot saying a word.  And he said, \"And another thing we do\" he said \"Is\nwe work for a break.\" He said, \"If we get a little ahead, we can go out\nthere and take a little smoke or go to the bathroom or something like\nthat.\" He said, \"Jim is fair enough to let us, if we get ahead, he'll\ntell us that we're running ahead, and he'll let us go smoke.\" And the\nfirst thing you know, I'll get another new one and tell him the same\nthing and this one will say, \"Now we're working for a break.\" (laughs)\nAnd I didn't have to tell him but once then he was telling the rest of\nthem, you know, when they came in.  But it worked out pretty good all\nthe way around.  Yeah.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Something interesting--you're talking about strange things\nor things that are different that he's encountered--um, tell them about\nthe old elevators that ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4500.0,4560.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/77","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"had the leather straps instead of cables.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: We had this D, D and B, you come down off with three barrels\nat a time, and it had an old strap for the thing and turn the wheel.\n \nF. JOHNSON: This is to lift the, for the elevator to go up and down, in\nthe old days they, instead of cables, they were leather straps.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: The cables going up here, but the thing about it, the thing\nthat's turning the wheel--that the cable's wrapped around--it was made\nout of leather.  And every so often, they'd have a big can of stuff\nsitting over there, and you'd have to go over and get the can and go up\nand down this belt because it'd start slipping on you.  Can you imagine\nstarting up there with three barrels of whiskey on it and this belt\nstarts slipping? You've got to go get the can and the belt, and do that\nto the belt then you take off--duh duh duh duh duh (chugging sound)--\nright on up there. That's D and B. Had ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4560.0,4620.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/78","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"two, had two elevators in D, one\non each side but you couldn't haul but three barrels at a time.  That's\nall you could carry on them was three barrels at a time.\n \nTROLAND: Were you the foreman for an individual, uh, warehouse, or, or\ndid your responsibilities include several warehouses?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: All of them.\n \nTROLAND: All of them?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah, I could go on-- anywhere they say to put whiskey I had\nto put it in that, in that particular house.  Um-hm.\n \nTROLAND: Now, Freddie, um, at a certain point in your life I imagine\nyour dad may have suggested to you the possibility of working at the\ndistillery.  When did that happen and what was the result?\n \nF. JOHNSON: Well, that was ac--it was actually during high school that,\nuh, he was, he was suggesting that, you know.  He was kind of asking\nme what I wanted to do.  I think he was more concerned about rent\nat the time than he was, he just wanted to make sure I was gainfully\nemployed.  But, but he was asking about it, and my background, uh, was,\nuh, actually engineering and electronics.  I had always been fascinated\nwith ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4620.0,4680.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/79","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that. I had actually won national recognition in a, for a\nproject that I'd done.  This was what, in 4-H when they sent me over\nto Washington, D.C? So, uh, so even when I got into high school it was,\nuh, it was science and engineering, mechanical drawings, mechanical\nengineering and things like that.  So, uh, that was just tucked away\nback there, so he had wanted me to do that but he couldn't figure out\nhow engineering would fit into working the distillery and following in,\nin his footsteps that would be the warehouse, okay, and going up that\nway.  And at the time that was going on, um, uh, I was in my, I was in\nmy second year at Kentucky State and, uh, AT\u0026T was doing a recruiting\ndrive, and they recruited me into an accelerated management program.\nSo I immediately came out of that, and it was kind of like he was\ndisappointed, but he was still supportive.  And he says, \"You know,\nyou know I want you to, you know, I want you to go on and do that.  You\nknow.\" He said, \"I'll support what you're doing.\" Um, and the way it\nturned out, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4680.0,4740.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/80","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"if I had have, if I had have not taken that job and I had\ncome to work at the distillery, just at that time was when ownership\nchanged and the distillery what, dropped down to about fifty people;\nfifty of about the most senior people? So the distillery was actually\nat one point getting ready to shut down and I would have been caught up\nin that, so I would have probably never, I would probably have not been\nhere today if I had come to work, uh, at the time he wanted me to come\nto work.  I would probably have not been here today.  So it was kind\nof interesting.\n \nTROLAND: What was the change in ownership that occurred at that time?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: And I got out just in time.  Just, I retired just about a\nyear before the other guys, other guys took over.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Yeah.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: And all those people lose their seniority, retirement,\neverything.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Yeah, it was kind of interesting.  It went from, um, I guess\nit was--that was back, I think, when the Shapiro brothers had it at\none time and then the, the Japanese ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4740.0,4800.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/81","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"corporation didn't have it but a\nbrief period of time and then it shifted again in ownership.  And then,\nuh, the family, the Goldring Family purchased the distillery.  So it\nwas during that transition that basically when that started happening,\nthey started stripping the distillery of, uh, of, uh, they spun off\ntwo warehouses to make, uh, office space for the state.  So those two\nlarge buildings, those two large warehouses were actually warehouses at\none time and now they're business offices for, for, uh, for the state.\nThey lease those, um, and they gutted a lot of the equipment out.\nThey sold the name.  So Schenley, the name Schenley which used to be\nup on the water tower is now a, a Canadian product, okay, and a lot of\nthe products went with it.  A lot of the equipment and technology and\nthings like that was basically stripped out, so it was a ware--it was a\ndistillery that had a lot of inventory, but as far as, uh, production,\nequipment and things like that to really ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4800.0,4860.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/82","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"crank up and run, it was\nbasically just being a cash cow living off of what was created here in\nyears past.\n \nTROLAND: What epoch was that that you described just now?\n \nF. JOHNSON: Beg your pardon?\n \nTROLAND: What time, what dates roughly?\n \nF. JOHNSON: Uh, that would have been prior to 1990 because in 1992\nis when the, uh, when the family purchased this distillery and went\nprivate.  So that would have been between, uh--you retired when? In\nthe seventies?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Seventy-eight.\n \nF. JOHNSON: So '78, so right at about '79 or '80 is when that happened.\nSo between 1980 and 1990 all this stuff happened and basically a lot\nof the employees went away.  They either retired or, uh, as Daddy said,\nthey got rid of seniority and stuff like that.  It was just like they\nstarted all over again, so they were down to fifty employees.  So the\ndistillery was basically getting ready to shut down is about what it\nwas.  I guess Gary Gayheart would have been the master distiller at\nthat time. So--Elmer--Elmer had retired, and ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4860.0,4920.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/83","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"uh--\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Not but three of them over at that side now.  That's Riddle\nand, uh--\n \nF. JOHNSON: Ronnie.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Ronnie and Kemper.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Yeah and Obie.  They're probably the original three.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Obie.  Tha--\n \nF. JOHNSON: They're probably the original three.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: They're the original three that are still left here that,\nuh, held on when the uh, when the change of hands, when the change of\nhands, of ownership.  Just those three that's over there now, that I\nknow of.\n \nTROLAND: Now, Jimmy, you worked at the distillery for more than fifty\nyears, uh, what is, what is one of the major changes you saw take place\nduring that time?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: I can't say--well, the thing about it, what could I say\nabout making too much of a change? There's not that much of a change,\nbut the thing about it, they'll hav-, off and on they'll handle more\nwhiskey than they did.  And that patching and stuff, that's one thing\nthat they stopped-- they just stopped patching the barrels, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4920.0,4980.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/84","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and just\ngot just enough leak hunters to, uh, once or twice a year or something\nlike that they go through and just kind of scan over the whiskey.  But\nat, uh, when I come along, they had, uh, at least ten men every day\ngoing from one warehouse to another just going through the ricks with\nlights.  That's all they did all day long was went through and just\nchecked to see if there was any whiskey leaking.  And they would write\nthe barrels up that was leaking or else fix the worm holes or whatever\nwas there that they could fix.  They just repaired the whiskey in the\nbarrels, so to speak, as best they could.\n \nTROLAND: So the technology of barrel-making must have improved over\nthe years so there are far fewer of them that leak very much.  Is that\ncorrect?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Well, the way that they talk, yes.  I'll say it that way,\nbut, uh, they still have a lot of barrels that have broken staves in\nthem and things like that.  And, uh, but they--what it gets down to, if\nthe stave is broken on the side or something like that, it just leaks\nout half ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=4980.0,5040.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/85","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the whiskey. You understand what I'm trying to say? If\nit breaks to where it leaks out half the whiskey, but just think what\nit would cost if they had to pay somebody every day.  With the leaking\nof the barrels, it's going to be near as much as, uh, what they have\nto pay the people every day to just go through the warehouses.  That's\nwhat Mr.  Smith was trying to say when it was going down the rat hole.\nThe money was going down the rat hole.  He's had twenty-three leak\nhunters and trying to get more.\n \nTROLAND: I'm going to stop here for just a moment.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Good idea.\n \n \n[Pause in recording.]\n \n \nTROLAND: All right.  Jimmy, you were saying that sometimes the river\nflooded parts of the distillery.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah, it flooded the lower parts--\n \nTROLAND: What happened then?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Well, as I say, uh, you'd see a, where they'd taken the\nbarrels out, you'd see a little ball, what looks like a little mouse\nor something going, and a few minutes later you'd see another one.\nAnd come to find out it was water. Uh, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5040.0,5100.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/86","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"those little dust balls would\nget water in them, and they'd start rolling right across the floor and\nit looked like a bunch of little mice going across there.  And that's\nwhen you could tell them, \"It's not going to be long fellows, because\nit-- when she starts rising, she's rising a foot every hour.\" So I said\nit wouldn't take very long.  So the water would just come right on up\nthrough, and there wouldn't be no more mice.  We called them the mice\nrunning across the floor.  But, that was one of the things we could\ntell when it was really coming up was watching, just watching for them\nlittle balls.  Yes, sir.  And then one, I had one fellow that, uh, was\nnamed Wes Moreland, we was getting ready to clean up after the thing\nwas over, and I had a bunch of men over the aisle on the floor brushing\nit out with hose pipes Crawling along pushing those hose pipes, and\nI had all the men back here like they was supposed to be, with a hose\npipe.  And Wes Moreland said, I said, \"Wes, it's your time.\" And he\nsaid, \"I'm not getting under there ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5100.0,5160.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/87","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"unless you get under there.\" And I\nsaid, \"All right.  Grab that hose.\" I said, \"I wouldn't do nothing I\nwouldn't tell you to do.\" And I said, \"You better be-, meet me on the\nother end of that aisle when I get down there.\" When I got down there,\nWes was right there beside me, too, because that was one time that\nI was going to carry him straight to the office because all the rest\nof the men had took their turn and went on through, and there wasn't\na complaint out of none of them.  And here he was going to show off\nand say he wasn't going to do it because I wasn't going to do it, and\nI'm the boss.  And I said, \"When I get to the other end, you better\nbe there.\" From then on, I didn't have no more trouble out of Wes,\nhe was one of the best men I had because he realized that if I caught\nhim doing something wrong, I would just carry him to the office and I\nwasn't going to play with him.\n \nTROLAND: Tell me a little bit about, uh, your experiences here at\nBuffalo Trace Distillery as an African American.  You were presumably\none of the few, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5160.0,5220.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/88","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm guessing, uh, one of the few African Americans\nworking here when you first came to work.  Is that true?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Um-hm.  I was one of the few.  Well--\n \nF. JOHNSON: You and Cruse.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Well, there was a bunch of them at one time.  It was,\nuh, Mr.  Blanton had a bunch over here, uh, in the n-, new whiskey\ndepartment because what they called the one-barrel gang or whatever.  I\nnever did get over there to see it.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Yeah.  It was the twenty-five--the gang, I think was it the\ngang of twenty-five?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Um-hm.\n \nF. JOHNSON: And, uh, they, uh, this building right over here is\nactually--uh, they used to make George Dickel Whiskey here at this\ndistillery.  So even during prohibition we were still making whiskey at\nthis site, and it was the gang of twenty-five and they just kept going,\nmaking whiskey over here.  So it's still got the old ramps and stuff in\nthere and everything else.  Uh, but, uh, Reverend Caldwell was one of\nthe, uh--he and Dad are probably ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5220.0,5280.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/89","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the oldest two living folks associated\nwith this distillery down here now.  I don't know how old Maxine is.\nMaxine is, I don't think she's as old as you.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: I don't know.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Um, but, uh, they remember, uh, whiskey when it was made back\nover in this old building over here.  Uh, so--I was trying to think.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: They called it--each man had a barrel or some way that they,\nthey could--had, uh, something, a two wheel-dolly or something.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Yeah.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: That they could maneuver them barrels around, and, uh, they\nwere all colored people.\n \nTROLAND: But the so-called gang of twenty-five was made up entirely of,\nuh, African Americans.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Uh-huh.  See I wasn't over in this area.  I was over on the\nwarehouse side and, uh, we had, never had too many blacks over there.\nThere was about five blacks over there on that side.  Walter Trill\nwas one of them and, uh, John Lankins and Dallas Peters ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5280.0,5340.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/90","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and--I'm just\nthinking, trying to think of the old ones.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Was Harris over there then?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Who?\n \nF. JOHNSON: Harris.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: No.  He was on the yard.  See, and that's another thing; they\nhad the yard gang that was all blacks.  You know what I mean? There was\nabout twenty in that gang, so there has been a good, a good many blacks\nwork here.  And then in the cistern room, well, uh, uh, there was Benny\nand, uh, Clay and, uh--let me see.  I know there was two of them.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Lonnie was, Lonnie was, was he cooking?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Lonnie, who?\n \nF. JOHNSON: Cousin Lonnie.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: I don't know what he was doing down there, but what I'm\ntrying to say, there was a yard gang and then several in the, in the\nwarehouse--Walter Trill, he was one of the janitors and, uh--\n \nF. JOHNSON: Had the mash house.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: And then, worked in the mash house\n \nF. JOHNSON: Um-hm.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: And there was at least fifteen on the ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5340.0,5400.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/91","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"yard.\n \nTROLAND: Did you have the feeling that at least from your perspective\nthe work environment for African Americans was a friendly one and a\nsupportive one?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Uh, just, there were just one or two guys that, uh, you\ncould say had any trouble out there, and by the rest of them taking up\nfor you, well, there wasn't much they could do about it because, uh--to\njust give you the idea about one fellow, uh, from--Cameron.  Morris\nCameron, he was a truck driver, and I had saved up my vacation from,\nfor two years, and I could get two weeks a year.  And I'd saved them up\nso that meant I'd be off for four weeks, and, uh, I was--we had plans\nto go out west; my sister and her husband and my wife and myself, we\nwere going out west just to tour around and everything.  And he come\nup to me and asked me, \"Jimmy,\" he said, \"I hear you're going out west\non a four, four week, four week, uh, vacation.\" And I said, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5400.0,5460.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/92","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Yes.\" And\nhe said, \"Well, do you have enough money to go all that distance?\" And\nI said, \"I hope so, anyway.\" And he said, \"Well, here.  Take my credit\ncard.\" How many people are going to give you their credit card to be\ngone a month on a vacation? Huh? You ain't gonna find very many to\ndo that.  That's what he did, and then, lo and behold when I got back\nhome, when I seen him, when I got back home I was laughing.  He said,\n\"What's the matter?\" I said, \"I got one ten dollar bill left.\" I had\nspent it all down to one t-, ten dollar bill.  Had a ten dollar bill\nwhen I rolled back into Frankfort, but I still had his credit card if I\nneeded it for anything.  Now how many people are gonna, you know what I\nmean? You just think of appreciating them trying to do things like that\nfor you.  And then he found out that I liked doves, and he had a farm\nup in Lawrenceburg. And one evening I came in, he came down to ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5460.0,5520.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/93","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the\nhouse and he had sixty-five doves that the people had gone out there\nand shot them in the evening.  They were, the sportsmen, sportsmen go\nout there and kill the doves that flew over, and he picked them up.  He\njust brought me sixty-five doves, and I was going around on the hill\nasking everybody, \"Do you want some doves? Do you want some doves?\" I\nwasn't about, wasn't about to make all of Cameron's doves.  But that's\nthe kind of fellow he was.\n \nF. JOHNSON: I was going to say that's an interesting observation,\nthough.  In the gallery in the gift shop there's a picture--remember\nthe one that you were referring to next door in here--that, uh, picture\nin the gallery goes back to 1870, and if you look closely at it it's\na mix of African Americans and whites gathered in front of the oldest\nresidential building in Franklin County, so it's the old Commodore\nTaylor Building, uh, and it shows you what was going on.  So even back\nthen you can look at the dress. Some of them ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5520.0,5580.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/94","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are dressed in little\nsuits, you know, kind of like dressed up, and others you can tell are\nthe ones that are doing the mash.  So some look like salesmen; some\nlook like workers.  Um, but that was in 1870, and we've just, we've\njust started looking back in history, and we discovered there were two\nthings that were kind of interesting.  The first was, like, even during\nthe Civil War and the Revolution and all that, there were two places\nthat never got attacked and that was hospitals and distilleries.  The\nhospitals took care of soldiers from both sides, and the distilleries\nsold whiskey to both sides.  Okay, so they never attacked those two,\nbut I had a person that, that came through on a tour one time that\nknew of a family member and their comment was this.  They said, \"It's\nno different than back up in the mountains.\" She said, the folks that\nlived around distilleries, that worked at those distilleries, were\nvery close-knit.  They had their farms, they took care of one another\nand basically the saying was \"we took care of our own.\" So it didn't\nmatter whether you were black or, you know, white, African American or\nwhatever. The point was is that if ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5580.0,5640.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/95","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you were part of that structure,\nthen you were just a member of that structure and so it didn't matter\nwhat people thought outside of that group.  Within that group you\nwere just another person working at the distillery.  So it's kind of\ninteresting.  So, uh, Dad commented that one of the restrooms, uh,\nhere at the distillery--at one time they actually had, you know, white\nand uh, black restrooms--and, uh, Dad said it was a, he said it was\na sad state of affairs.  He said, uh, the whites used their bathroom\nas much as they did.  (laughs) So it wasn't like, he said, \"If you\nneeded to go, you just went to the nearest restroom.\" You know, so that\nwas something that was, uh, it was done, but, you know, even at the\nChristmas parties, the, the two groups were separated when it started.\nWhen the party first started up, the Christmas party, the whites were\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5640.0,5700.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/96","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"upstairs and the blacks were downstairs in, uh, in another area. And,\nuh, he said, \"But, by halfway through the night,\" he said, \"Everybody\nwas all gathered around and they were just all talking and laughing;\nhaving a good time.\" So, uh, you know it was there, but it was not, it\nwas just not--\n \nJ. JOHNSON: It was most, though, the office except for one or two in\nthe office force that tossed the whole thing and, uh, eventually they\nfound out it wasn't going to work the way they wanted it to work.  And\nthey just, you know, you could go in any bathroom you wanted to in the\nend, and if you was just close to this one, you went to this one and\nthat's the way it finally ended up.  And it finally ended up that the\nplace where the blacks were supposed to go, they ended up in a chicken\nhouse.  (laughs)\n \nTROLAND: Over the fifty years, uh, Jimmy, that you worked here, did\nyou see any significant change in attitudes towards African Americans\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5700.0,5760.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/97","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"working here?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: No.  Not that much, just that one or two every now and then,\nyou'd run into one.  I had an incident where, uh, in the re-gauge where\nI came through there one evening, and, uh, this fellow said, \"We are\nclosed.  You can't come through here.\" And I said, \"Well, all the rest\nof them are going through.  Why can't I go through?\" And he struck me,\nuh, and they grabbed me.  The rest of them grabbed me.  And I said,\n\"Wait a minute.  He hit me.  I'm just coming through here with you\nall.\" He said, \"Don't you hit him back.\" And they helped me; wouldn't\nlet me.  I don't know how they imagined this because I can't hit him\nback.  He said, \"You go tell your daddy.  Right now.\" He said, \"You go\ntell Dad.\" And I went and told Dad, and Dad came right straight to the,\nor went right straight to the office.  The next day, he didn't have no\njob.  So that cut out a whole lot of it right quick.  You understand\nwhat I'm trying to say? That cut out a ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5760.0,5820.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/98","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"whole lot of it quick. And\nanother time that it happened, uh, they hired a brand new fellow, and\nthat time of morning, well, we all met out in the, over there by the\nre-gauge room--that's where we got toge--together to get the different\ngangs separated--and they hired this new guy in, in, uh, Dad's gang.\nAnd he called his name off, and he let Dad know real quick he didn't\nwork for nobody black.  And Dad told him, \"Thank you.\" Said, \"Stand\nover there.\" And so he called them rest of them--he was in the new\nwhiskey at that time--he called the rest of them over, said, \"Now you\nall know just about where you're supposed to be.\" Said, \"Go on take\nyour places.\" He said, \"Now you come on with me.\" He said he looked\nback at him and kind of halfway grinned.  You know, and he carried him\nin to Mr.  Fissum and said, \"Mr.  Fissum, this is one of the fellows\nyou hired this morning, but he don't work for no blacks.\" Mr.  Fissum\njumped up out of his seat said, \"Oh, my Lord.\" Said, \"Get him off of\nthe lot just as quick as you can.\" Said, \"If we owe you anything, when\nyou go by the office, they'll pay you,\" but, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5820.0,5880.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/99","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Get him off the lot right\nquick.\" That cut out, might have cut out in a way of speaking anybody\nelse that had any kind of an idea about something like that, that\nthey, they wouldn't be welcome down here, and that's the way that the\ndistillery went all the way through.  And we very seldomly have really\nany kind of ugly things around here.  It went real well.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Um-hm.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: One of the ones that really gets a tickle, though, Mr.\nBlanton was getting ready to catch the train to go to New York and,\nuh, Mac Miller was his chauffeur.  And so Mr.  Blanton called up to the\ntrain station and told them, \"I'm going to be just a lil-, few minutes\nlate, but I'm on my way.\" Said, \"Would you, would you hold the train\nfor me?\" Told him who he was.  So they said, \"Yeah, we'll hold it for\na minute or two.\" So Mac had him up there to the station and he got\nhis ticket and went in there and sat down on the train, and the train\ndidn't move.  And so Mr.  Blanton said, \"Well, what's wrong?\" Said,\n\"I'm on the train.\" And the conductor said, \"Well,\" ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5880.0,5940.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"said \"You got here\non time,\" but said \"That little fellow, a little fellow in a little\nge-, car out here had backed down over the track, and we've got to\nwait to get a wrecker to pull him out.\" So Mac had backed out over the\ntracks and train still couldn't move, and come to find out it was Mac\nthat backed over them.  (laughs)\n \nF. JOHNSON: It was his own chauffeur that had run out onto the middle of\nthe railroad tracks.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah.  That was Mac for you.\n \nTROLAND: Now, Freddie, you've of course come back to work here, um, in\npart perhaps for family tradition but also, uh, to perform a valuable\nservice.  What do you like best or least about being a tour guide here?\n \nF. JOHNSON: I, I thoroughly enjoy it.  It's, uh, it's amazing in taking\nthe tours one of the things, uh, someone had asked me on one of the\ntours, the change that I'd seen in the distillery from the time that\nI was a child and coming back now and, and doing these tours. And ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=5940.0,6000.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we\nwere up on the, uh, up by the stills out looking over the distillery,\nand I said what amazes me is I said, \"The people have changed but\nthe process is still the same.\" And you start looking at these old\nwarehouses, these old warehouses are still cranking out the product\njust like they did back in the 1800s.  You know, the temperature has\nchanged a little bit.  Um, the stills, the stills are still, they're\nnot--we've got one new still; a little Micro--a little Microstill--but,\nuh, the traditional stills have been here for years and years.  Um,\nthey're learning of, they're learning more about the barrels and, and\nthings that you can do for the aging of your products and things like\nthat, but the process is still the same.  And so we're just learning\nmore about something that the Scottish and Irish learned about many,\nmany years ago.  So for me it's fascinating to see the things that,\nuh, you know that ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6000.0,6060.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Mark and Harlen and all of them and Elmer and Ronnie\ncontinue to stumble upon and they, by, by chatting and talking about,\n\"Well, what if we did this? What if we did this?\" You know, we've got\nover 1500 experimental barrels right now so, uh, if you think about 1500\nexperimental barrels sitting the warehouse--and prior to Prohibition\nthere were over 2000 distilleries just in Kentucky.  So what, uh, what\nI tell folks, uh, that take a lot of the tours, I said, \"You know,\" I\nsaid, \"you look at these 1500 barrels, you look at the 2000 families\nthat were around here before prohibition.\" I said, \"Some of the best\nbourbon in the world is yet to be remade.\" And that's what they're\ngoing through right now.  They're, they're just putting other little\npieces together, and each time they do that, they uncover another taste\nprofile that creates an entirely different flavor and smoothness to\nbourbon. So it's a, I guess it's, uh, it's an act of love. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6060.0,6120.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"(laughs)\n \nJ. JOHNSON: I'll tell you one thing that I really was surprised--and yet\nI am still--is one they hadn't thought of a long time ago is how they\ncould work in that, start at the cistern room and kick that barrel out\nthe door and don't have to touch it no more until you're ready to put\nit in the rick.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Yeah.  The barrel runs?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Um-hm.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Yeah.  The barrel runs based on the way they are and the\nlifts and the, and the, uh, rick elevator's on the outside of the\nwarehouse, so it can just go right on over to the warehouse it's going\nto and--one stop shop.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: See, it used to be trucks that had to haul those barrels,\nand that was three men right there.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Um-hm.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Truck driver and two helpers, so now, now they just kick the\nbarrel out the door.  Doom, doom, doom, doom, doom (rolling sound) and\nthe first thing you know, the next man to touch it is up there tough--\nrolling it into the rick.\n \nF. JOHNSON: One of the most, Tom, probably one of the most significant\nthings as far as technology goes is the mapping ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6120.0,6180.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the process. They--\nwith bar coding and computers--uh, it used to be Gary Gayheart and Elmer\nand all of them and Dad and, uh, Granddad and all of them, you kept\nup with all of those 200--over 200,000 barrels; you kept up with it on\npaper ledger.  What they've done in today's environment, uh, they've\ngot a thermometer on every floor, middle of the warehouse, every floor,\nevery warehouse; you've got a barrel with a thermometer in it.  And,\nuh, so you've got optimum temperatures that you're tracking for every\nfloor of every warehouse, and you just keep doing readings on that.\nSo you're monitoring what the seasons are doing and, and the, the, uh,\naverage temperature of your product.  Um, you've got, your bar codes are\ntracking the, where the trees are coming from.  They go down and mark,\nthey tag the trees they want to make the barrels from.  Uh, they've\nkind of, like, honed in on, uh, what's the right char to use based on\nthe amount of time you want to age the bourbon in the warehouse ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6180.0,6240.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and\nhow long you want to leave it there and what floor you want to put it\non.  So they've got all those things that they're doing now: size of\nthe barrel.  What's the significance in the size of the barrel and does\nthe size make a difference in your taste profile of your bourbon over\ntime--so all those things are new things that are coming along that,\nthat tells you that we're just on a threshold of a whole new evolution\nto bourbon.  Okay.  So, yeah.  Those things are things that, that if\nI look at when I was five years old coming in here and things that I\nsee today, uh, you're working just as hard at producing a, a better\nproduct, but you're doing it smarter based on data and based on things\nthat you know are why the settlers did it this way many years ago.  So\nyou're building on a foundation, so it's pretty cool.\n \nTROLAND: When the day is done and you go home, perhaps you occasionally\npour yourself a bourbon.  Uh, if so, what do you pour?\n \nF. JOHNSON: Well, I, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6240.0,6300.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/106","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"um, I'm following my Dad's, uh, doctor's\nprescription, and the doctor told him that he's supposed to have, uh,\na shot of bourbon a day.  So, uh, on a good day we have at least one.\n(laughs)\n \nJ. JOHNSON: But the thing about it, I had a heart attack at seventy-\neight and, uh, doctor told me, he said, \"Jim,\" he said, \"I'm taking\nyou off the heart pills.  Listen to me.  I'm taking you off the heart\npills because they get to be habit forming.  Heart pills get to be\nhabit forming, but,\" he said, \"I want you to take a drink every day.\"\nNow what is the difference with taking a pill that's going to be habit\nforming and taking a drink everyday and then sooner or later that's\ngoing to be habit forming, too? But I took him up on his word, and I\ntake the drink every day.\n \nF. JOHNSON: And the answer, and the answer to the other part of your\nquestion is that Buffalo Trace has been interesting.  Okay? Uh, it used\nto be--(whistle ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6300.0,6360.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sounds)--twenty-five after. Uh, it used to be that,\nuh, Ancient Age was kind of like the, the drink of choice, and that's,\nit's, uh, basically a high volume bourbon.  Uh, so when Benchmark,\num, when, uh, Benchmark came along, that was another one, and now it's\nBuffalo Trace, one that, uh, is a pretty good mix.  So, uh, if I'm just\nsitting around sipping, Buffalo Trace is excellent as a small-batch\nbourbon, and then the other one is Eagle Rare which is a single-barrel\nbourbon.  So, and both have unique taste profiles to them, so those are\nthe two that we kind of, like, pretty much enjoy sipping on.\n \nTROLAND: I see, so, Jimmy, too, you might take a Buffalo Trace or you\nmight take a Eagle Rare?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah.  Whichever one I can get close to.  (laughs) Doesn't\nmake no difference.\n \nTROLAND: I see.  That's, uh, that's always a good choice.  Is there\nanything, uh, Jimmy, uh, that you'd like to say that I haven't asked\nyou about so far?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: No. Not that I can think of anything. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6360.0,6420.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Just, just glad to\nbe here with you all, and I've enjoyed myself.  Of course, I've been\nafter those two women because I've been wondering when in the world\nthey're going to get back here.  I've got both of them, both at the\nhairdressers.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Oh, no.\n \nTROLAND: And you, Freddie, anything I haven't asked you about that you'd\nlike to comment on?\n \nF. JOHNSON: Um, the, uh, the thing that probably, uh, hits closest to\nhome for me is, uh, is the recognition of my father and my grandfather\nand their contribution to the distillery--(Jimmy coughs)--Um, I, uh,\nI've mentioned to Angela and to Mark Brown and to, uh, to Meredith\nand, uh, Amy and, uh, and, uh, Ronnie and, uh, and Leonard.  They know.\nIt's the, um, the treatment of my father when he comes back; keeping\nhim involved, uh, in ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6420.0,6480.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"things going on at the distillery, recognizing his\ncontributions or getting him involved.  And I honestly feel like that,\nthat has enhanced his quality of life and it's, uh, it's increased his\nlongevity.  And, um, as I mentioned to, uh, to Mark Brown, I told him,\nI said, \"If there's every anything I can do, uh, for this distillery\njust for what it's done for my father,\" uh, he only has to ask.  Uh, I\nfeel that good about it.\n \nTROLAND: I'm struck in talking to the two of you as well as to, uh,\nRonnie Eddins and, uh, and, uh, Leonard, uh, Leonard, excuse me.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Riddle.\n \nTROLAND: Riddle, sorry.  Forgive my, uh, failing memory.  Leonard\nRiddle.  I'm struck by the sense of community that exists here, and\nit's fascinating to hear you say that, uh, this sense of community goes\nback as, uh, your memories, your collective memories, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6480.0,6540.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"uh, indicate so\nfar in time.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Um-hm.\n \nTROLAND: And that they encompass both black people and white people\nand, um, all the people who are around this area.  That's, to me, a\nfascinating story, and, uh, thank you very much for taking the time out\nto, uh, speak to us about this.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: One that he mentioned and we forgot to talk about, uh, we\nwere in O, in, uh, R warehouse around ten o'clock in the morning, and\nwe had some work in there to do and then after that we were going over\nto O--and that's clear across the railroad track on the other side,\nnow--and so we were leaking with, oh, what's his name? One of the\nfellows had a, that was a leak hunter, he had his tools in a bucket,\nand he was walking along--\n \nF. JOHNSON: That wasn't Frosty, was it?\n \nJ. JOHNSON: No.  Frosty was a tiller.  And the thing about it, uh,\nStokes.  Stokes.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Uh-huh.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Stokes was the one that, uh, had this stuff in his bucket,\nand he was a leak ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6540.0,6600.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"hunter; stopper. And he had all his tools and\neverything, and when we was going up--now we done walked all the way\nacross from that warehouse from clear over to here--and started up on\nthe elevator and Stokes said, \"Jimmy, there's something funny.  I can\nsmell pole cat just as if it was walking along beside me.\" And I said,\n\"You can? I don't want nothing walking beside you to hit it.\" And he\nlooked down in that bucket under just the little cloth that he had in\nhis bucket, and there was pole cat that he was packing all the way over.\n \nF. JOHNSON: They'd stuck a skunk, a little dead baby skunk in his--\n \nJ. JOHNSON: In his bucket, and he was carrying that thing along.  And he\nwas stinking up the breeze, and he said, \"I'm smelling it just as if I\nwas carrying it along.\" And then he realized he was carrying it along.\nHe said, \"If I knew who put this damn thing in here, I'd get him, boy,\nand lose my job.\" And everybody looked at Frosty because we knew who\ndid it.  Frosty done put it in there, and he's standing right there\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6600.0,6660.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"beside him. Yes, sir. He put that pole cat in his bucket, and he done\npacked it all the way across there.\n \nF. JOHNSON: But there's a, even at this distillery today, there's still\na, a good, there's a core group of people that are still good.  Uh,\neven new ones coming in, uh, you know, there are, there are three or\nfour around here right now that are just as good as they can be.  And\nthey're, that's the foundation, so you've got a new group coming in.\nAnd they realize this, the, uh, the significance of what they're doing\nand that the barrels going in there right now, uh, that's their name\ntwenty years from now, so, uh, and a lot of them see that.  And that's,\nthose are the good ones.  Those are the ones that's going to be around,\nand you're happy to run into those folks so--\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah.  Dad had a little old tobacco crop out there, and, uh,\nthey'd ask, \"Jimmy, when you gonna get, when you gonna ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6660.0,6720.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"bring your crop,\nbring your crop in?\" \"Oh,\" he says, \"I'll get it in a day or two.\" In\na day or two, you'd better believe they'd all go out there and help\nhim get his little tobacco crop in.  I'm sitting up there driving the\ntruck, driving the truck, and he'd want to holler every now and then.\nI'd reach up and get a hand in just about turning brown and put it in\nmy mouth.  He'd say, \"You'd better hurry up and get the crop in 'cause\nJim's going to eat some.  He's staying up for it.  Get it in the barn\nwhere he can't get it.\" Yes, indeed-y.  But that's what-- the kind\nof friends they were.  They would go out of their way to help you if\nyou had any kind of problem.  And then hog-killing day, that was just\nanother, another picnic.  They would come out and just have a big time\nkilling hogs and things like that.  Uh-huh.\n \nF. JOHNSON: But thank you.\n \nTROLAND: Well, thanks again both to you, Freddie and Jimmy.  Uh, it's\nbeen a pleasure talking to you both and, uh, I know I've certainly\nlearned a good deal.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Oh, hey, Freddie.  Can I tell them the one about--\n \nF. JOHNSON: No.  (laughs)\n \nJ. JOHNSON: I was going to tell them the one about when I was a ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6720.0,6780.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"soldier.\nI was in a soldier in, uh, on Guam, and I had twenty-one prisoners,\nJapanese prisoners, that I was in charge of, and I couldn't whip the\nlittlest fellow.  He was just, he knew karate, and I couldn't a bit\nmore whip him for nothing.  And yet, still I was guarding all twenty-\none prisoners with an empty gun, and some of them guys was six foot\ntall, didn't have no way to whip them.  Couldn't really whip the little\none, but we got to be the very, very best of friends.  I told 'em, one\nday, I told 'em me, five sons over the waves.  That's the way I talked\nto him, and I never heard a bunch of men as disgusted as they were\nwhen I told them that.  And they went back and tore up a sheet--now\neach one of them got a square of that sheet--and there was one in the\nbunch that was an extremely good drawer, and he drew something on that\nsheet pertaining to ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6780.0,6840.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Japan. And he didn't have no crayons, but where\nthey needed something green, they got green grass, if they needed tan,\nthey got tan coffee stains, needed some black, they got black co-, coal\ndust.  And they were natural beauties, and I carried them home and they\ngot damp down in the basement.  And I threw them away, and they were\nstill good.  You could read it, make them out real good, but I just\nthrew them away.  It's no telling what those things would have brought\nif I'd got them to the right people, and knew that I was that kind of\nfriend to those soldiers over there.  No telling what they would have\ngive me for it, and yet still I had three naked ladies in this bunch of\npictures.  And do you realize I didn't, the last, when I carried them\nto the basement was the last time I seen them?\n \nF. JOHNSON: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6840.0,6900.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You just never know what happens to good art.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Do you hear what I'm saying? I don't know what happened to\nthem, but I had all them others.  And I'm wondering who would have--\n \nF. JOHNSON: Sometimes art just, it's priceless.  You know? It's just\ngone.  (laughs)\n \nTROLAND: That's right.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Are you listening to this? I'm asking her.  Are you\nlistening to this? Something happened to them, but I don't know what\nhappened to them.  (laughs)\n \nF. JOHNSON: I blame my brother.  My brother blames me.  Hey, what you\ngoing to do? Long as it's two, no one can be held accountable.  (laughs)\n \nJ. JOHNSON: (laughs) But there's no telling what I could have gotten for\nthe thing had I kept them and kept them dry.\n \nF. JOHNSON: What, what he, when he talks about some of these things,\nwhat I tell him is sometimes the worth is not in the tangible.\nSometimes the worth is, uh, is the intangible that has a lot, again,\nto do with character and the type of person that you are.  So that's,\nuh, and that's you.  So they just said what they thought of you, Dad.\n \nJ. JOHNSON: Yeah.  Um-hm.\n \nF. JOHNSON: Okay.\n \nTROLAND: Do you ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6900.0,6960.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/transcript/3/annotation/117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"think, Freddie, that by the time your dad turns ninety-\nthree he'll finally outgrow his shyness or, uh, will it take longer\nthan that?\n \nF. JOHNSON: No.  I think he's just getting his second breath.\n \nTROLAND: Oh, okay.  (laughs)\n \nF. JOHNSON: His second breath.  Yeah, he's off and running again.\n \nTROLAND: Well, it really is a pleasure to talk to you both.  I looked, I\nremember with pleasure meeting you both in May, uh, uh, at the event of\nthe barrel rolling.  We chatted briefly here in this building after the\nevent during the reception, and--\n \nF. JOHNSON: Um-hm.\n \nTROLAND: Uh, and it was just a wonderful time to hear some of these\nstories.  And that's actually what gave me the idea of suggesting to\nAngela that we do this oral history project because I thought these\nstories--(clearing throat)--should be preserved; this history should\nbe preserved.  And so Angela, uh, supported this and Mark Brown has\nsupported this and the University of Kentucky has supported it and, um--\n \n \n[End of interview.]\n \n \n \n \n ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=6960.0,7020.0"}]},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/index/3","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["2009oh019_bik002_johnson_ohm.xml [Index]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/index/3/annotation/118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Jimmy's childhood","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Title"]}}],"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=0.0,391.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/index/3/annotation/119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Jimmy Johnson and his son Freddie are introduced. 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","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Synopsis"]}}],"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=391.0,1128.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/index/3/annotation/125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Freddie, tell me a little bit about yourself.","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Partial Transcript"]}}],"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=391.0,1128.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/index/3/annotation/126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Childhood","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Subjects"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Distillation.","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Subjects"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Distillers.","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Subjects"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Distilling, illicit","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Subjects"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Families.","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Subjects"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Frankfort (Ky.).","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Subjects"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Whiskey.","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Subjects"]}}],"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=391.0,1128.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/index/3/annotation/127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"Running water\"","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\"String of pearls\"","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Bets","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Character","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Contests","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Creeks","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Cutting trees","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Fathers","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Felling trees","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Fishing","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Fishing trips","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Friends","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Grandfathers","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Growing up","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"hunting","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Moonshiners","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Outhouses","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Parents","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Proofs","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Relationships","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Revenuers","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Sons","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Whiskey-making","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}}],"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=391.0,1128.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/index/3/annotation/128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Jimmy's father's career at Buffalo Trace Distillery","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Title"]}}],"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3#t=1128.0,1793.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/3/file/3/index/3/annotation/129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Jimmy's father worked at the Buffalo Trace Distillery for 52 years and was one of the first African American foremen. 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