{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/iiif/zs2k64b44q/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["Interview with Harlen Wheatley, October 30, 2008"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/002/original/1b9c652bf856b30cc9684b8a547e8758.png?1549330641","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Agent"]},"value":{"en":["Harlen Wheatley (Interviewee)","Thomas Troland (Interviewer)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Date"]},"value":{"en":["2008-10-30 (created)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Identifier"]},"value":{"en":["2009oh021_bik003 (cms record id)","2009OH021 BIK 003 (accession number)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Relation"]},"value":{"en":["Buffalo Trace Oral History Project (BIK003) (is part of)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Format"]},"value":{"en":["video"]}},{"label":{"en":["Description"]},"value":{"en":["Harlen Wheatley, from Florence, Kentucky, came to work at Buffalo Trace in 1994 after graduating college with degrees in chemistry and chemical engineering.  In 2005, Wheatley became master distiller.   In this interview, Wheatley explains what master distillers do, including their responsibilities in the distillery and with the public. Wheatley explains the origin of bourbon and defines bourbon. He describes the process of bourbon production, including the selection of ingredients, cooking, fermentation, distillation, aging, and tasting.  Wheatley also talks about how variables in the different stages of production can affect bourbon's flavor. He explains that Buffalo Trace produces experimental bourbons to explore the effects of these variables. Wheatley then talks about the renaming of the distillery and the Buffalo Trace brand. He also discusses the future of the distillery and the bourbon industry as a whole. (summary)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Keyword"]},"value":{"en":["Yeast","Alcohol--Law and legislation","Chemistry.","Whiskey--Analysis","Liquors--Gaging and testing"]}},{"label":{"en":["Subject"]},"value":{"en":["Whiskey (local term)","Whiskey industry--Kentucky--History. (local term)","Buffalo Trace Distillery. (local term)","Distilleries--Kentucky (local term)","Whiskey industry--Kentucky (local term)","Bourbon whiskey (local term)","Distillation. (local term)","Quality control. (local term)","Quality of products. (local term)","Distillers. (local term)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Rights Statement"]},"value":{"en":["All rights to the interviews, including but not restricted to legal title, copyrights and literary property rights, have been transferred to the University of Kentucky Libraries.","Interviews may only be reproduced with permission from Louie B. Nunn Center for Oral History, Special Collections and Digital Programs, University of Kentucky Libraries."]}},{"label":{"en":["Source Metadata URI"]},"value":{"en":["00048047 (2009oh021_bik003_wheatley_ohm.xml)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Duration"]},"value":{"en":["01:12:27"]}}],"summary":{"en":["Harlen Wheatley, from Florence, Kentucky, came to work at Buffalo Trace in 1994 after graduating college with degrees in chemistry and chemical engineering.  In 2005, Wheatley became master distiller.   In this interview, Wheatley explains what master distillers do, including their responsibilities in the distillery and with the public. Wheatley explains the origin of bourbon and defines bourbon. He describes the process of bourbon production, including the selection of ingredients, cooking, fermentation, distillation, aging, and tasting.  Wheatley also talks about how variables in the different stages of production can affect bourbon's flavor. He explains that Buffalo Trace produces experimental bourbons to explore the effects of these variables. Wheatley then talks about the renaming of the distillery and the Buffalo Trace brand. He also discusses the future of the distillery and the bourbon industry as a whole."]},"requiredStatement":{"label":{"en":["Attribution"]},"value":{"en":["All rights to the interviews, including but not restricted to legal title, copyrights and literary property rights, have been transferred to the University of Kentucky Libraries.","Interviews may only be reproduced with permission from Louie B. Nunn Center for Oral History, Special Collections and Digital Programs, University of Kentucky Libraries."]}},"provider":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["Louie B. Nunn Center for Oral History"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["Louie B. Nunn Center for Oral History"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/002/original/1b9c652bf856b30cc9684b8a547e8758.png?1549330641","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/000/004/small/open-uri20190204-2161-1s23hhk?1549331303","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 1 - 2009oh021_bik003_wheatley_acc003 from Nunn Center for Oral History on Vimeo"]},"duration":4347.0,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/000/004/small/open-uri20190204-2161-1s23hhk?1549331303","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://player.vimeo.com/video/253464488","type":"Video","format":"video/vimeo","duration":4347.0,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["2009oh021_bik003_wheatley_ohm.xml [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"TROLAND: My name is Tom Troland, and we're interviewing today Harlen\nWheatley who is the master distiller at Buffalo Trace Distillery.  This\nis October 30, 2008.  This is part of the Buffalo Trace Oral History\nProject, and we are here at the Buffalo Trace Distillery.  So thanks\nvery much, Harlen, for taking time out to, uh, to talk to us.  Let me\nbegin with a very general question.  Just tell me a little bit about\nyourself.\n \nWHEATLEY: Well, I was born in Mount Sterling, Kentucky, and, uh, I grew\nup in Florence, Kentucky, which isn't far from here; about sixty-five\nmiles north.  And, uh, went to high school there and then went to\ncollege at UK which is just about twenty-five miles east of here.  And,\nuh, so I literally haven't left, strayed far from the nest and, uh,\nuh, really didn't leave Kentucky until I started this job to be honest\nbecause, um, you know, we didn't--just didn't do a lot of traveling.\nBut, uh, so I'm, I'm a Kentucky, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=0.0,60.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Kentucky born and bred kid working at\na, working in an, uh, industry that's been around for quite a while, so\nI'm kind of, kind of happy that worked out that way.\n \nHAY: Okay I'm just going to pause here.\n \n \n[Pause in recording.]\n \n \nWHEATLEY: --the, uh, sales fell off and, um, inventories grew because of\nthat and, um, literally created inventory because of sales dropped off.\n \nTROLAND: Uh-huh.\n \nWHEATLEY: And now, it's kind of like, um, the way bourbon was found in\nthe first place.  It was by accident; same thing.  And really the aged\nbourbon was kind of found by accident that the inventory grew because\nof the market, and next thing you know people love it.  So now, now\nour task is to create the aged bourbon, so you know we've kind of,\nkind of gone in waves as an industry, you know, based on the market and\npeople's, people's tastes and so on, so--\n \nTROLAND: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=60.0,120.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Are we rolling again now?\n \nHAY: We're rolling, and I'd like to know what that original accident was.\n \nTROLAND: The original accident, okay.\n \nHAY: That he was just talking about.\n \nTROLAND: Shall we talk about that now?\n \nHAY: You don't have to.\n \nTROLAND: No, let's, uh--I have some other questions I'd like to ask\nabout, uh, growing up and so forth, but um, let's, let's go for that\nnow.  Why not? How did bourbon originate?\n \nWHEATLEY: Bourbon originated as a, it really wasn't even called\nbourbon at the time.  It was a whiskey, and people in this area known\nas Bourbon County--uh, Bourbon County was all of north, you know,\nuh, Northeastern Kentucky was all Bourbon County at one time--and,\num, the whiskey was made in that area.  And it literally started by\npeople ordering the whiskey down river, and down river, I mean down\nthe Mississippi.  And they would load it in these barrels that had\nbeen cleaned, sanitized by, by charring them, and then by the time\nthey got ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=120.0,180.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"them--it took about six months, six or seven months to get\nall the way down the Mississippi--and in seven months' time it would\nturn, uh, a really dark bourbon color, and we have examples of that\nhere that--and, you know, in seven months' time, that, that product's\na pretty good product.  And, um, but the problem was, they ordered\na clear spirit and wondered what's going on.  They would call up and\nsay, Hey, what's going on? Not call, but they would send messages and\nsay, you know, What's the deal? And next thing you know they liked\nit, same way with the aged bourbon now, and they liked it and the,\nthe market just caught on.  And they would specifically order, uh, the\nclear spirit from Bourbon County and, uh, you know, that had been aged\nin these barrels, and so it would pick up this color and flavor from\nthe wood.  And they shortened it up over time instead of whiskey from\nBourbon County, they would call it bourbon whiskey and then eventually,\nuh, you know, legally it's known as bourbon whiskey.  In 1964 Congress\npassed a, a ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=180.0,240.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"law that states that Bourbon has to be made in the United\nStates, and we have to have all these regulations, uh, based on, um,\nbased on what bourbon is.  We have to have 51 percent corn, it has to\nbe distilled at less than 160 proof and aged in a brand new white oak\nbarrel and, um, and made here in the United States.  And all those\nthings are designed to protect the product, so um, so the flavor has,\nis basically protected.  Now you, each distillery makes its own product\nand stays within the, the legal limits, but through processing and, and\nproduction, you can make it taste a little different.  So that's--each\ndistillery makes a little different product, but it's all good and, um,\nit's all kind of a protected product in the United States; one of the\nfew things the United States makes that is protected like that.\n \nTROLAND: When--\n \nHAY: I'm just going to put you on hold for a second.\n \n \n[Pause in recording.]\n \n \nTROLAND: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=240.0,300.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You spoke of this, uh, accidental discovery that bourbon\nimproved with age.  When roughly did that happen?\n \nWHEATLEY: That was around the late 1700s, around 1780, 1785, somewhere\naround there and, uh, we actually have records of shipping product down\nthe Mississippi to New Orleans.  And the nice thing for us is our parent\ncompany is from New Orleans, so we have a long history of connection\nbetween New Orleans and Kentucky basically as, as our, you know, for\nBuffalo Trace.  And, um, once it was discovered then the next thing\nthat you know that's all we, that's all we produced and aged it then we\nstarted building warehouses.  Um, our first large warehouse, big--new\nwarehouse was built in 1870, around 1875, and then, uh, we expanded\nto Warehouse B which was around, uh, late 1800s and then C. D was our\nthird, uh, large warehouse produced in ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=300.0,360.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"1907, and then, you know, every\nyear as our inventory grew we would build more warehouses, and we're up\nto twelve warehouses.  We, we're using eleven of them, um, and we're up\nto twelve and we currently need another one.  So, I mean, if you look\nback through the history--and it's interesting--as we, as we increased\nin size, also the architecture changed.  You know, the first warehouses\nwere brick and built with ornate limestone windows and, and, uh, you\nknow, and as, as time went on, the architecture changed, you know, and\nwe started building with, um, blocks.  And so we have the full gamut of\narchitecture here, you know, based on history and, uh, what was popular\nat the time.  And come to find out, it's nice because for us we have\nthirteen different products and it gives us different flavors.  Each\nwarehouse has a little different flavor, and so, um, and that's, that's\na ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=360.0,420.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"nice thing to be able to have those different architectures which\ncreate different flavors, so it works out nicely with our portfolio.\n \nTROLAND: Tell me a little bit about--\n \nWHEATLEY: Did I mess it up?\n \n \n[Pause in recording.]\n \n \nWHEATLEY: We're taking a lot of steps to understand it.  We're doing\na lot of experimenting and testing and, uh, because we're very,\nuh, interested in knowing how to reproduce these things; all these\ndifferent flavors.\n \nTROLAND: Tell me a little bit about how the different, uh, warehouses\nproduce a different product.\n \nWHEATLEY: Well, we have, like I say, brick and block and we have metal\nclad, and all of those things create different atmospheres around the\nbarrels.  And we're very careful to rick all of our barrels--and when\nI say rick, we put them up in a rick and lay them on their side--and\nwe create an air pocket around every single barrel.  And what that\ndoes is it allows you to, uh, manipulate basically the flavor inside\nthat barrel. So if you have a ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=420.0,480.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"barrel on an upper floor versus a\nlower floor, for instance, you're gonna experience more heat, a little\ndifferent humidity level, and so you're going to get a quicker aging.\nFor us it's going to be a quicker aging, a little hotter probably,\nuh, depending on flavor, uh, recipe, too, so all those things are\nfactors.  Um, so if you took, for instance, a wheated bourbon and put\nit up on the top floor and we're going to age it for twenty years,\nwe know that, that would not be a good thing because it's aging too\nquickly for that product.  So we would put it down on, like, a second\nfloor of one of the warehouses, one of probably the brick warehouses\nor the block warehouses where it ages pretty constantly, you know,\nconsistently and, over a twenty-year period, it comes out a really\nnice flavor.  And we're very careful when we put barrels away to take\nall those things in consideration, so somehow or another we have to\nfactor in the raw ingredients, the biological process that it takes to\ncreate the, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=480.0,540.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the raw ingredients, we have to take into consideration the\nbiological process of fermentation, we have to take into consideration\nthe people that produce everything which is a biological process and\nthen we also have to, uh, take into consideration the aging concept.\nAnd every barrel is different.  The wood comes from different\nlocations in mountains.  You know, different levels of sun hit the tree\ncreating a, a different thickness in the wood, and all those things\ngive it different flavors and at the end of the day you have to make\na consistent product.  So that's kind of the idea to be able to, to\ndo that, and for us, like I say, to have thirteen different bourbons,\nwe're able to, you know, select the barrels and bourbons that match\neach taste profile and that's the idea.\n \nTROLAND: You used the term \"wheated bourbon\".  Can you explain that?\n \nWHEATLEY: We, we make five recipes here, and the, the two most common\nbourbon ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=540.0,600.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"recipes are corn, rye and malted barley--that's one recipe--and\nthen there, you substitute and take out the rye, and so you put corn,\nwheat and malted barley, and those are the two most common recipes\nout there.  Um, and so we make both, and we make different levels of\neach one based on which product we're producing.  So we'll have a high\nrye or a low rye bourbon and then we have a wheated bourbon line that\nwe offer up.  We start at seven-year-old and we go all the way up to\ntwenty-three-year-old for wheat, and the wheat is a, is a traditionally\na mild, sweeter bourbon.  It's, uh, less spice; less sharpness.  It\njust, uh, overall ages better than a rye bourbon, in my opinion.  So,\nyou know, if you asked me my favorite age for a wheated bourbon I'd\nsay around twelve years old.  If you asked me a rye bourbon, I would\nsay around eight to nine, maybe even ten, uh, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=600.0,660.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so--but it's all based on\nrecipe and flavor and depends on where it ages, too, and which product\nit is.  So--\n \nTROLAND: I read in a book that you also produce a barley, uh, whiskey.\nIs that, uh, true and if so, what, uh, do you use that for?\n \nWHEATLEY: We've made a barley whiskey.  We haven't made it in awhile,\nbut we made a barley whiskey and we, and to be honest, it was used\nfor the drink So-So-Sojhu in Japan, and they would take it over and\nmix it in for that.  We made that for a while.  Um, we stopped making\nthat.  We actually have an experiment where we're aging, some barley\nwhiskey, uh, to see how it comes out, um, but we haven't made any of\nthat in a while.  But barley whiskey is a little different for us just\nbecause we're not really, we're set up to produce bourbon and all of\nour equipment is set up to produce bourbon, and barley whiskey is a, a\nlittle bit of a different animal, uh, because of the way you handle the\ngrains and the cooking process and, and all that. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=660.0,720.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So that's kind of\nthe reason we stopped producing it.\n \nTROLAND: Take me through just briefly, if you will, the, the process of\nproducing bourbon.  You've already discussed some matters along those\nlines, but from start to finish.\n \nWHEATLEY: We have, uh, we used to get all our grains in by rail, and\nin the early nineteen--about 1981 we stopped, uh, the rail, uh, from\ncoming in.  So everything is delivered by truck, by semi.  We, we\ntake all of our grains, bring them in by truck and clean all of our\ngrains again.  We, we order our grains clean, but we also clean them\nourselves and put them into our silos and store--we try to keep four\nor five days of inventory on hand--and we go through, on a given run,\nwe go through about eight thousand acres of corn, two or three thousand\nacres of rye, two or three thousand acres of malt.  And, uh, when we\ngo through all this grain, we get it in the silo; we'll pull it out\nof the silo and grind it. We grind it through a ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=720.0,780.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"screen, and it's a\n10/64th of an inch screen or 5/32nd.  But we do that because we--we've\nexperimented trying to go up or down on that screen size--and we do\nthat for yield reasons and flavor, and, uh, we've found that if you\ngo to small, it makes a difference or likewise if you go too big.  So\nfor us, it was, that's what we settled on, and once we grind it up, we\nput it in our cookers.  And we cook our bi--our corn separately from\nour small grain.  We call small grain, we call small grain, uh, malt\nand rye or wheat, and we cook that up under atmospheric conditions.\nSo we'll cook it up in a small cooker and then we cook our corn in a\npressure cooker and then we blend those two slurries together after we\nget done cooking.  So we cook everything up and then it takes us about\nforty-five minutes to cook one cook and, uh, currently we're running\nsixteen of those cooks a ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=780.0,840.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"day. And we produce about 170,000 gallons of\nmash every day, and we take all that mash and put it in the fermenters\nand, at that time we start out yeasting process where, uh, the yeast\nwill start to grow and do its job and we don't pay it a penny.  It\ndoes all the work, and it produces our alcohol for us.  And we take\nthe alcohol once it's completed--we call it a beer.  And, you know,\npeople say, Well, you're making beer.  Well, we are making beer, but\nthe problem--the difference is we have all the solids, all the grains\nstill in there and we don't separate those things out--so we pump\nall that beer through the beer still, and that's where we literally\nseparate the good clean alcohol from all the solids and everything left\nover.  And so at that point, we're, we're creating two products.  We\ncreate, we call it a setback that comes off the bottom of the still and\nwe call, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=840.0,900.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and alcohol coming off the top, and we distill at different\nproofs based on our recipe.  So for us we have five recipes and we have\nthree main distillation proofs, and we'll come off somewhere around\n135 proof off the still.  And we take that good clear, clean liquid\nthat they used to drink in the mid-1700s, and we put that into the\nbarrel.  And then at that point, the aging process takes over, and the,\nthe goal is to extract certain flavors from the barrel, uh, based on\nour recipe again.  So that's an important step, but we also have that\nbyproduct of setback, so we take that setback off the still and we\nput that in, back into the fermenter.  And we call that, that's how we\nsour our process, and souring is literally just dropping the pH of the\nfermenter.  So we--the pH of that is about a 3.45, and we take that,\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=900.0,960.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"uh, setback and pump it back into the fermenter and sour the mash. So\nthat's, that's how you start the souring, sour mash process, and all\ndistilleries do that.  All distilleries use sour mash, and what that\ndoes it creates a buffer in the fermenter to stop bacterial growth that\nyou, undesirables from being produced in the fermenter and then it also\ngives you a second shot at a little bit of starch that's left over and\nit creates consistency because you're getting like flavors from batch\nto batch.  So it's a very important step in the fermentation process,\nbut literally what creates the flavor at the end of the day, you have\nraw ingredients, you have the fermentation and you have distillation\nand then you have aging.  Those four things are the critical key, uh,\ningredients for producing different flavors of bourbon, and you can\nvary each, each of those four things within the limits of the ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=960.0,1020.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"law and\nthat's how you create those different flavors.\n \nTROLAND: Tell me about the yeasts.  Uh, where do you get the yeast? Do\nyou use more than one type of yeast? How do yeasts vary?\n \nWHEATLEY: The yeast is, uh, one of the, one of the key steps in the\nfermentation process, um, because the yeast is what determines how much\nof what alcohol is produced at what levels.  So every distillery has\ntheir own strain of yeast, and we isolated our yeast in 1932 and we\ncall it Dr.  LeSha Number Two.  And the story is Dr.  LeSha himself,\nwho used to work here, um, isolated three different yeasts, and he\nliked number two.  So, you know, very scientifically we said Dr.  LeSha\nNumber Two, and it's still called that to this day.  And, uh, we've\nkept that same strain every year because we feel like it produces a\nnice balance ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1020.0,1080.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of higher alcohols, ethanol and aldehydes and things that\ncreate the bourbon, and also esters is a key ingredient, too.  And\nwe feel like it's the best overall yeast for our process, and we also\nonly use one yeast for all of our bourbons because we're a little bit\nfearful of introducing other yeast for one thing.  And we don't want,\nwe guard it very--we, we have it in five different locations around the\nworld, so we're, we're very protective of this yeast.  It's really our\nlivelihood and, um, so it's a key step in the process.\n \nTROLAND: What is an ester?\n \nWHEATLEY: An ester is a, um, product that's produced during fermentation\nthat gives it a fruity, uh, character.  Um, it gives you some of\nthe, uh, not--spicy notes, but, uh, ester's a key step in the process\nbecause without it it'd be kind of a ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1080.0,1140.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"bland, a kind of a bland drink.\nAnd some people, you know, even can say they taste, uh, dark candied\nfruit and all these things, but I promise we don't put dark candied\nfruit in.  But those are all things created by esters, and it's, it's\ncreated during fermentation and then it's carried through the barrel.\nIt doesn't change in the barrel, so those esters are enhanced by aging\nin the barrel.\n \nTROLAND: You mentioned that several proofs off the still are used\nat Buffalo Trace.  What are the considerations, uh, that come into\nchoosing the proof?\n \nWHEATLEY: The--the important part about proof is when you're distilling\nsomething, uh, you have to reflux.  Um, what I mean by reflux, as you\ndistill some of it has to go back into the pot in order to get your\nproof right and that determines flavor.  So if you distill at a really\nhigh proof, for instance like vodka at 190 proof, you have to do a lot\nof ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1140.0,1200.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"refluxing to get that proof up high and then when you get the proof\nup high you're also reducing the amount of different flavors that are\nin the product because your proof is so high.  There's only a few things\nin there, and ethanol has a very distinct flavor.  Uh, it's supposed\nto be flavorless, but for me it has a flavor.  I mean, the flavor is\nflavorless--(laughs)--and, uh, it's kind of sweet and, um, it's what\ngives it that, that character.  So depending on where you select your\nproof is what type of alcohol's going to come over.  At a lower proof,\nyou're going to get a lot heavier alcohols than you do on a higher\nproof, and so there's a balancing act of which one you like the best.\nThe higher alcohols, we call them congeners in the business, and the\ncongeners is literally what flavors the product before it goes into\nthe barrel, and then all those things react with the extracts from the\nwood and create those different flavors.  So, um, you know, we try to\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1200.0,1260.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"balance not too high, not too low, and we want it to be, you know, just\nright.  And again, the yeast determines a lot of that, too, so you have\nto have a balancing between the yeast and the, and the distillation.\n \nTROLAND: What would be an example of, uh, of, uh, a whiskey you were\ntrying to produce at low distillation proof?\n \nWHEATLEY: Uh, an example of that for us would be the W. L. Weller.  We\nhave a wheated bourbon and, uh, the design for that bourbon is to be a\nnice, uh, smooth, sweet and mild bourbon.  And in order to, to preserve\nthat, we, we give it lots of flavor by--with a low proof and then we\nput wheat in it instead of the rye, and we age it for at least seven\nyears--and we have a Weller Twelve, too.  It goes up to twelve--so,\nyou know, from the very first day of raw ingredients, distillation,\nfermentation, the whole thing, uh, it's designed to produce that\nflavor. So that would be ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1260.0,1320.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"an example.\n \nTROLAND: What about the barrels? Are all barrels more or less the same?\nAre they different? Can you control that?\n \nWHEATLEY: Yeah.  The barrels actually are all exactly different.  Uh,\nthere's not one barrel that's the same, and, um, we produce all our\nbarrels to one spec.  We want fifty-three gallon barrels.  We want\nnumber four char which is a fifty-five second burn on the inside,\nand we feel like that's the best overall balance of flavor for our\nproducts.  But all the wood is different, and, as I mentioned before,\nthe, the tree is a ve-, very big determining factor of the flavor.\nThe bottom of the tree might have more coconut in it than the top of\nthe tree.  The top of the tree might have more vanilla in it than the\nbottom of the tree, and, and so depending on where they slice that\ntree and make a stave, all those things are selected ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1320.0,1380.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"randomly and then\nput into producing a barrel.  So we can age, we can pick up a barrel\nand age it with the very same day's production, put it in the same\nrick in the same warehouse on the same floor and those two products\nwill come out slightly different in, you know, within the first seven\nmonths.  You're going to start picking up a little bit of different\nflavor, and that's really the whole genesis of single-barrel bourbon.\nAnd in 1984 we launched it, uh, based on people, uh, selecting certain\nbourbon barrels because they liked it, and we didn't want to mix it\nwith other barrels.  And, uh, the Blanton's was our first single-\nbarrel, and that's the first one to ever hit the market.  And since\nthen everybody's copied that, but that's the idea.  You bring that one\nbarrel that tastes that certain way and you put it in that bottle, and,\nand you don't mix it with anything else and you offer it up as a single\nbarrel. So it's a very super, high quality ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1380.0,1440.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"bourbon that's been tasted,\nand we know it's good when it goes into the bottle.  And that's the\ngenesis of the whole thing because every barrel's a little different.\n \nTROLAND: So all the barrels that you receive here initially, uh, as\nfar as you know, are the same.  There's no attempt to make different\nbarrels different.\n \nWHEATLEY: Oh, no.  No.\n \nTROLAND: It's just they turn out differently in the end.\n \nWHEATLEY: Right.  It's a complete random process and, uh, you know,\nagain, it's white oak .  It's all from a general location; mostly from\nMissouri, some Kentucky and Ohio and Indiana but mostly, uh, Missouri,\nthe Ozark Mountain region.  And, um, so it's a very, um, isolated--from\na world perspective--it's kind of an isolated area, but all the wood\nis a little different.  So it depends on soil and sun and the amount\nof trees that are around it, and all those things are factors.  And\nwhat side of the mountain it was on is a determining factor so, uh, no,\nthere's no real, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1440.0,1500.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"um, there's no intent to have different barrels. It's\njust a random process.  Now one thing we did because we like to do a lot\nof experiments and we're known to, to do those--we have an Experimental\nCollection, that's behind me--but, uh, one of the experiments we did\nwas we did that.  We went out and selected certain trees, and we call\nit a single tree bourbon.  And we went out and GPS coordinated one tree\nat a time.  We selected them.  We documented how many rings that were\nin that tree, how, you know, what age it was, where it was on the tree.\nWe did soil samples.  We did the whole thing, and so then we took\nthat one tree and produced a barrel from that tree and then we're aging\nbourbon with it.  So right now they're about six years old, and we're\ngetting some very good flavors, differences between the trees.  But\nwe did fifteen hundred trees that way, and so we're able to, a nice\nexperiment to be able to get, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1500.0,1560.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"uh, you know, differences in flavors.\nAnd then hopefully our idea--and I told you that earlier--we like to\nbe able to understand all these things that we do to be able to create,\ncreate these different flavors, so we might be able to connect the\ntree to the different flavors in those bourbons.  And then we can maybe\nisolate some of the, some of the flavors, you know, based on that.\nThen all the bourbon manufacturers will love us because we'll order\ncertain trees, you know, but, uh, that's the idea.\n \nTROLAND: That brings up the Buffalo Trace Experimental Collection and\nall of the experiments that you have done.  Can you tell us, uh, a\nlittle bit more about, uh, these various experiments with bourbon\nproduction that have gone on here?\n \nWHEATLEY: Yeah.  We started a pretty heavy experimental program about\n1996 and, uh, we, we put away a, uh, a bunch of experiments based on\ndifferent ideas that we had at the time.  And we, we've launched a\nfew of them ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1560.0,1620.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to the public to try to get feedback across the, across\nthe United States, and we're trying to get feedback on some of these\nexperiments; some of them good, some of them bad.  And we kind of\nfeel like the best bourbon has never been made, and we're still\nworking to make the very best bourbon ever.  And, uh, so we've got\nabout, about thirty-five large experiments in the warehouse right now\naging.  We have about 1500 separate, uh, barrels on those thirty-five,\nuh, experiments, and so we're able to isolate thing like proof and\ndifferent woods and different grains and different distillation\ntechniques and all these different things that we've always wondered\nabout.  But the idea is for us to hone in on different flavors and, and\nbe able to hopefully produce someday the best bourbon ever.  But, uh,\nwe've tried some, you know, anything ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1620.0,1680.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you can think of pretty much, and\nwe literally have a list of a hundred different ideas and it's just a\nmatter of going down and doing the list.  And the problem was always\nthat in order for us to do an experiment, our minimum batch was sixty-\nfive barrels, and for us that's a pretty large capital investment.  And\nwe're family owned and sometimes we, you have to come off the hip to do\nit, so one of the things we did was we invested in a micro-distillation\nprocess where now we can produce all the way down to one barrel at a\ntime.  So now literally it's a little quicker for us to do experiments,\nand we can produce, you know, do many more experiments.  So we, we\nhave this big long list of experiments to do, and now we have the\nmechanism to get them done.  And so it's, uh, kind of exciting, and\nit's something that we can do because we're privately held and we can,\nyou know, try to produce all these different flavors.\n \nTROLAND: As you've said, Buffalo Trace has a, a smaller experimental\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1680.0,1740.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"still. How does that still, apart from size, differ from the still\nyou normally use and is it a still producing different flavor profiles\nbecause of the way it's designed?\n \nWHEATLEY: Yeah.  The still, um, was designed to produce whatever we\nwant.  It's an extremely versatile hybrid still, and, um, every single\ndetail about that still was thought out about, um, you know, what type\nof materials to use, what size and so on.  And it's a little different\nfrom our large still, but we can scale that up.  A lot of the things\nthat we put on that still was based on our large still, and we're able\nto produce anything from any proof from 190 plus down to a hundred\nand, you know, 120 proof or whatever.  So we're able to put multiple\nproducts in it.  We're able to pull off different trays.  Um, we can\npump it and reflux it as much as we wanted to, so it's a really ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1740.0,1800.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"truly a\nversatile still.  And it's nice as a distiller to be able to literally\nmake whatever you want.  Uh, and we can, you know--also have a small\ncooker with it--so we can, we can cook up small, very small batches\nand, like I say, get all the way down to one barrel at a time.  And,\num, we also have a small fermenter there, and, um, we can ferment at\ndifferent lengths and different styles and so on.  So it's a true, uh,\nnice micro-distillation system that allows Buffalo Trace to, to do all\nthese experiments without, without interfering with the money-maker,\nthe main production, you know.  And, uh, that's nice, too.  Somebody's\ngotta pay the bills.\n \nTROLAND: You used the term \"reflux\".  What, what does that mean?\n \nWHEATLEY: Reflux is, uh--you learn about that during, um, what was the\nname of that movie? The reflux capacitor for, uh, time travel? What was\nthe name of that movie?--anyway, the ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1800.0,1860.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"reflux is--\n \nHAY: Back to the Future.\n \nWHEATLEY: Yeah.  Back to the Future.  There you go.  It's back to\nthe, everybody knows that.  But anyway the, uh, reflux is, uh, if\nyou distill something out of, off of a still, you could just run it,\nvaporize it, condense it and pull it off one pass, but if you did that\nwhat would happen is if you started off--let's say you had a concoction\nof 8 percent alcohol, namely beer which is like a moonshiner would do,\nnot that I know anything about moonshining--but anyway, they, uh, you\nrun the 8 percent and you--\n \n \n[Pause in recording.]\n \n \nWHEATLEY: Are we okay? So the, uh, reflux is, uh, so if you took an 8\npercent batch out of a, out of a, uh, still of beer and distilled it\none time, you know, you could get it up at first to maybe 150 proof\ndepending on the size of your batch, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1860.0,1920.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but as soon as you start pulling\nstuff off, the instant you start pulling stuff off, the proof starts to\ndrop because the alcohol concentration drops.  So over time, it might\nstart at 150, but you'll end up to zero, of course.  So that's one pass,\nso in order to maintain a consistent proof, you have to pull some of\nthat product off and put it back into the pot and so then you can maybe\nhold about 135 proof for a while with some reflux.  And that's, and\nthe ratio of reflux to product is the key step in distillation.  So you\nhave to determine how much reflux to put back to get to what you're,\nyou know, your desired output.  Reflux ratio is, is something that's\ncommon throughout all distillation no matter what you're producing;\ngasoline, you know, uh, diesel fuel, any of those things also use\nreflux ratio to produce a consistent product ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1920.0,1980.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at the end of the day.\n \nTROLAND: You don't distill gasoline here?\n \nWHEATLEY: We don't distill gasoline, no.  It'd be, it'd probably pay\ngood money right now, but we, we stick to the drinkable stuff.\n \nTROLAND: I noticed when recently visiting the distillery that you have\nsome small barrels aging in the warehouse.  What is the, uh, thought\nbehind those?\n \nWHEATLEY: The small barrels is one of our experiments, and, um, the\nthought process is to produce the same juice, the same liquid, and put\nthem in different sized barrels to determine what the size of barrel\ndoes to the flavor.  So we put them in our standard fifty-three gallon\nbarrels, and then we have some in fifteen gallon barrels, ten gallon\nand fi-, five gallon barrels and we did multiples of each.  And so at\nthe end of the day when we're done with the aging, we'll be able to\ncompare those to a standard barrel and say, Well, this was the same\njuice when it went in.  This is, um, some of the differences that,\ndepending on size ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1980.0,2040.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"because you have different surface area, you know,\num, in, in touch with the, uh, liquid.  And so that should create\ndifferent flavors.  Now that won't account for the differences in\nbarrels, but you should see a trend, of, based on size of barrel.  So\nat the end of the day we'll be able to determine if we should make a\nsmaller or bigger barrel maybe.  The accountants will like that because\nif you go down in size then it will cost a lot more money.  (laughs)\nBut, uh, it does determine flavor, so we want to know that.  And at\none time, we actually produced forty-eight gallon barrels, and around\n1965 we changed from forty-eight gallon barrels to fifty-three gallon\nbarrels, so at that time, you know, there was probably not a lot of\ndifference in flavor and all that bourbon's long gone.  But--\n \nTROLAND: Is the fifty-three gallon size the industry standard?\n \nWHEATLEY: That's an industry standard. Yeah. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2040.0,2100.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And, uh, all the ricks,\nall the racks that are used to store the barrels are based on fifty-\nthree gallon barrels, so you have to be, you know, if they're too big\nthey won't fit into the ricks.\n \nTROLAND: Take me through a typical day on your job as you perform it\nat present.\n \nWHEATLEY: A typical day is--we run five days a week currently, uh,\nMonday through Friday and, uh, some areas run twenty-four hours a day.\nSo a typical day is I come in as early as I can, 6:30 or something,\nand I'll come in and make sure everything is up and running the way\nit should be.  And so the first thing I do is I check, um, do some\nquality checks on each of the steps and, uh, make sure everything is\nto spec.  And, uh, at the end of the day the name of the game for us\nis to be consistent and to be, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2100.0,2160.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, we're making products that\nwere produced fifty years ago and the idea is to not change any step\nof the process.  Along the way, you can make improvements, but at the\nend of the day, you can't change the flavor.  So you have to take all\nthose things into consideration, so there's always room for improvement\nand different ways of doing it but you have to make sure you don't\nchange the flavor.  So the first thing I do is make sure everything\nis up to, uh, spec, make sure everything's up and running, make sure\nthere's no problems, and then, uh, I'll go around and make sure all\nthe guys are doing what they should be doing.  And, uh, then, then the\nnext thing is to evaluate what needs to be done next, uh, you know,\nwhat projects do we have in line? We have a lot of, a lot of projects\nthat we have, so we're always working on different projects and that's,\nwe try to organize them in a, in a fashion to where we prioritize our\nvery important projects and work on those most of ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2160.0,2220.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the time. So I'll\nspend, you know, half the day working on projects and, um, maybe the\nlast half of the day, uh, we'll work on tasting products to make sure,\nuh, get them ready for single-barrel bourbons or, uh, uh, you know,\ncheck on the barrels to make sure our inventory's right; uh, make sure\nall the paperwork's filled out properly.  So literally every step of\nthe way, um, uh, some people call it the, uh--you know, you have to be\nin control of what's going on, and you have to set boundaries based on\neach operation and make sure everything's happening the way it should\nso, and at the end of the day be a consistent product.  And you do\ntry to attempt to control those biological processes I was telling you\nabout, so you have to, you know, at the end of the day, take all of\nthose consider--into consideration and, and produce those consistent\nproducts.\n \nTROLAND: Is the master distiller responsible for all phases of ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2220.0,2280.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"production\nof the product or primarily responsible for the distillation phase?\n \nWHEATLEY: At Buffalo Trace, the master distiller is responsible for\neverything along the way from start all the way to the point of\ndumping it into the bottling tank.  So you're responsible for all\nthose production, all those production steps and processes.  Um,\nother distilleries the master distiller might be primarily responsible\nfor education for, for instance, but here, you know, I'm, I'm in the\ntrenches.  I'm responsible for all the work and then I also try to\ndo educational, uh, work, too.  So I try to balance those things, but\nyeah.  We're, um, we're, uh, we're into a lot of different things,\nso you're responsible for production basically of all the spirits;\nnot only bourbon but vodka, whiskeys and anything else we produce.\nSo my whole team of people--we have about forty-eight people in the\ndistillery ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2280.0,2340.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and, uh, which to me is not a, not a lot--and, uh, we, we\ntogether as a team, uh, produce all these different products.\n \nTROLAND: So the master distiller is perhaps also in some sense the plant\nmanager, being responsible for the whole, uh, sequence of steps from\ndistillation through aging and dumping into the bottles.\n \nWHEATLEY: Yeah.  If you refer to the plant as the distillery, yeah.\nWe have, you know, we have a plant manager here and, um, he's also\nresponsible--not only do I report to him--but he's also responsible\nfor distribution, shipping and bottling.  So there's more to it, you\nknow, at this site.  We have, and everything on this site is done\nhere.  All the shipping and bottling is all done here, so everything\nwe produce comes from here.  We have over five and a half million cases\nthat come out of here and, uh, all different products.  And there's\nlots of processes and lots of steps, and, I think, we're up to about\ntwo hundred and fifty total ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2340.0,2400.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"employees. So out of the two hundred and\nfifty, forty-eight of them is on the distilling side where we do the,\nyou know, production of the spirit, but then there's also the, all the\nprocessing and bottling and shipping and all those other steps that are\ninvolved so it just depends on what you call plant, I guess.\n \nTROLAND: So the aging process is also within your purview?\n \nWHEATLEY: Yeah.  Yeah.  We have, uh, like I say, I have, uh, luckily for\nme, I have, uh, two guys that have been at--in the distillery and in\nthe distilling business together for ninety-four years, and the aging\nwarehouse manager has been here since 1964 and the aging warehouse\nsupervisor has been here since 1966, I think, or '65.  So those two\nguys I rely on heavily for their experience.  Uh, you know, I bounce\nideas off of them, and, uh, they're just great and they take care of\nthe, uh, a lot of the day-to-day aging things. But, um, it's nice ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2400.0,2460.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to\nbe able to draw on that experience, too.  And we also recently hired\na, um, a, uh, aging warehouse supervisor to learn under those guys and\npick up some of that institutional knowledge, and, and so we're kind of\nwatching for the future, too, you know; banking on the future so that\nguy can kind of take over that day-to-day operation.\n \nTROLAND: (clears throat) Excuse me.  The two gentlemen you referred to\njust a few moments ago are Ronnie Eddins and Leonard Riddle.  Is that\ncorrect?\n \nWHEATLEY: Yeah.  That's right.  That's exactly right.  Yup.  Ronnie\nis a, is, uh, cream of the crop, and I'll tell you, he's been doing\nthe same, uh, same job now since 1964 so he's very familiar with the\noperation, uh, and where each and every single barrel is.  And, uh, I'm\nable to, uh, use that.  Uh, it's a tremendous asset for us and, uh, and\nfor me. So that's a very important part of the process ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2460.0,2520.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"really.\n \nTROLAND: One of the, uh, signature products of this distillery, of\ncourse, is Buffalo Trace, uh, bourbon, and it has a specific flavor\nprofile that you're looking for.  Explain to me, uh, how it is that,\nthat flavor profile is achieved; that is to say from the selection\nof barrels, uh, to the tasting.  Who does the tasting, who does the\nselecting, uh, to create that flavor profile you want from Buffalo\nTrace?\n \nWHEATLEY: You know Buffalo Trace is a relatively new bourbon for us.\nWe started it in 1999.  That was the first year it hit the shelves.\nIn 1998, we basically had a meeting, and I was luckily lucky enough\nto be in, kind of on the ground floor of this project.  And we had\na meeting and decided, um, We're going to change the name of this\ndistillery because nobody knew it was the Stagg Distillery; George T.\nStagg Distillery.  Legally, that's what it has been for a long time,\nand it really was a lost name. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2520.0,2580.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we wanted to come up with a name\nthat was respectful for the heritage of the distillery.  I mean, this\nsite was literally where the buffalo crossed the Kentucky River, and\nthe settlement known as the Leestown Settlement was settled here in\n1773.  And we started the distilling process with that settlement, and\nwe've expanded this place ever since then.  And we're walking on the\nsite of the original settlers of this area, and so we really had no\nconnection so we said, \"What better name than Buffalo Trace?\" And so\nwe've got this great name and this great facility.  What are we, what\nkind of bourbon are we going to put in it? And so we invited fifteen,\nuh, retired individuals, fifteen people from the plant, and we sat down\nand did some tasting.  And we voted basically on what bourbon we want\nto represent Buffalo Trace.  And so we all voted, and we came up with\nthis eight-year-old, small ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2580.0,2640.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"batch bourbon; not much of it out. There's\nnot much small batches out there, but for us small batches is forty\nbarrels or less, and for that we're able to, to really have tight range\non the flavor.  And we felt like eight-years-old was the best overall\nflavor for a rye bourbon.  We chose rye because of the spiciness, the\nflavor profile, you know, it just had a nice smooth, nice kick.  Um,\nninety proof because we feel like that's Kentucky proof.  It's strong.\nUm, all those things are selected for a reason and, uh, it's the best\noverall bourbon, everyday bourbon.  So we selected the bourbon and then\nthe next thing was package.  What kind of package do we put this in?\nWe wanted it to be in a nice, uh, represent--new bottle, new style but\nstill kind of, uh, respectful of the, of the other bottles out there.\nSo we came up with the bottle that we have and then the label itself\nwe voted on by the ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2640.0,2700.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"employees here. So we'd isolate it down to five\nlabels, and then we had all the employees come in at lunchtime.  And\nI remember we wrote the, we wrote, we voted for which of those five\nlabels we liked the best, and at the end of the day, this is the, the\nlabel that we came up with.  And that bottle represents this distillery\nand, uh, that's the way we came up with the product in the first place.\nNow the next thing is, how do you make it consistent? So we make this\nfirst batch, and we love it.  We think it's great.  So the next batch\nwe produce, we go out and select forty barrels and we taste them, and\nthen we compare those forty barrels to that very first batch.  And\nwe've been doing that ever since 1999.  We took that first batch, and\nwe saved a bunch of samples, and then we use that as our standard,\nand then we compare every single batch to that very first batch taste\nprofile.  And we still do that, and so we're able to be very consistent\nand offer up, you know, if you taste the bottle now, it should taste\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2700.0,2760.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"very, very close to the very first batch we ever produced. And, uh,\nlike I say, it's a best overall representation of the distillery, and\nit, it pays homage to all of the heritage here and all the people and\nall the employees.  So we're very proud of it, in case you can't tell.\n \nTROLAND: When you, uh, do the tasting, who actually is involved in, in\nthe tasting process?\n \nWHEATLEY: We have, we have a tasting panel up--of tasting professionals.\nMyself, um, uh, and at least four others taste in the, uh, laboratory,\nand we'll get those forty barrels and put them on a table.  And the\nnice thing about that is we don't argue amongst each other.  If one\nperson out of the four, five or six that tastes that has an issue with\nthat one barrel, we turn it, and it's out and there's no arguing.  Uh,\nyou know, if you, if you don't like that taste profile for any reason\nor you don't think it matches the original, we turn it, and it's over.\nAnd, uh, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2760.0,2820.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I like it because it's a hundred percent. It's either all\ngood or, you know, there's a difference.  We haven't made bad bourbon.\nIt's just a little different sometimes, so the nice thing is if a\nperson's off sick or out then you still have that nice panel to be able\nto, uh, taste those.  But we have a, a group of individuals that do\nthat.  That's kind of how we do all of our projects, by the way.  You\nknow, it's a team effort.\n \nTROLAND: Is the same tasting panel used for the, uh, the other products\nin your line?\n \nWHEATLEY: Yeah.  Yeah.  We have, uh, the same professionals.  Now we\nalso do, from time to time, have, uh, have people that don't normally\ntaste, taste because we want to know if a general public, uh, comes in\nand tastes something for the first time what they think.  So we also\ndo that, too.  We have a, we try to do a little of both.  We try to get\npeople who normally don't taste to taste it and see what they thing,\nbut, uh, we do have a, a taste, professional set that we use for ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2820.0,2880.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"all of\nour products.\n \nTROLAND: When you select those forty barrels or so for the next batch of\nBuffalo Trace, do they typically come, those barrels, from a particular\nwarehouse?\n \nWHEATLEY: Yeah.  We, we generally use three warehouses, uh, currently.\nNow it's, we really feel like we could probably use all the warehouses,\nbut we, right now, we're using three of our eleven warehouses for\nBuffalo Trace.  And we try to stay in the middle floors because we\nfeel like that's kind of the average, um.  Uh, it experiences the most\noverall differences in weather and so you get a lot of nice aging.\nAnd it's not too much over the top at the top floors and it's not too\nlittle at the bottom.  So it's really kind of a representative of the\nbest average bourbon, that, you know; the best average flavor, I should\nsay.  Hopefully it's not an average bourbon, but.\n \nTROLAND: Tell me a little bit about, about, uh, your work, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2880.0,2940.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"uh, as a\nrepresentative of Buffalo Trace.  In modern times, the master distiller\noften is the public face, uh, behind the product.  How, uh, do you\nspend your time in that particular, uh, position?\n \nWHEATLEY: We do, uh, we do that as much as we can.  Uh, I do, uh, I\nhave traveled, uh, across the United States and some across the pond,\num, to, um, promote and educate about Buffalo Trace and all of our\nproducts.  And, um, I do that, um, as much as possible.  I probably\naverage one or two trips a month, and, uh, maybe--most of the time,\nit's an overnight trip or something because, um, I do try to stay\nreally close to the operation and make sure nothing happens.  You\nknow, I kind of feel like, um, on, on that note, I kind of feel like,\nyou know, I've got the baton that's been passed to me.  I'm the sixth\ndistiller since the Civil War, and I've got the, you know, I've got\nthe, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=2940.0,3000.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the baton now and I have to carry it. And so I have to make\nsure everything's done right and, uh, so I watch that really closely,\nbut I also go out and try to educate.  We do a lot of bourbon dinners\nand, uh, bourbon tastings and try to show people the differences that\nare out there and, you know, believe it or not, there are people that\ndon't know what bourbon is and that's hard for me to understand.  But\nthere's 80 percent of the general public don't know what bourbon is\nacross the United States, and that's a, that's something that's, that's\nnice because there's an untapped market out there of people who have\nnot experienced bourbon.  And so the education piece is important; to\nbe able to teach people what an American spirit is, what, kind of what\nthey're missing, um, and what--how, how to appreciate some of these\ndrinks.  And, um, you know, I, I get excited about that stuff.  I\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3000.0,3060.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"like doing that and, um, it's kind of, it's kind of a perk of the job\nto be able to, to explain, you know, and brag about the guys and the\ndistillery and all the things we do here.  So I enjoy that part of it.\n \nTROLAND: Speaking of education, I was, uh, recently in a, uh, pub\nin Ireland, and I saw on the wall a list of their spirits available\nwhich included American whiskeys.  And the list of American whiskeys\nincluded, um, Canadian Club and Southern Comfort.\n \nWHEATLEY: There you go.\n \nTROLAND: Now what, uh, what's your reaction to that?\n \nWHEATLEY: Well, believe it or not, you don't have to go to Ireland.  I\nmean, you know, I do it all the time and, uh, not so much in Kentucky\nbut a lot in Kentucky you can go in and say, \"What kind of bourbon do\nyou have?\" And they say, \"Oh, we got anything you want.  We got Jack,\nwe got Crown, you know, we got some Jim Beam\" or something like that.\nSo that's part of the education process to explain to people the\ndifference between a Canadian whiskey and a, and a Tennessee ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3060.0,3120.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"whiskey\nand a bourbon and, um, one of the things we like about having a bourbon\nis that there are regulations.  You know, uh, there's certain things\nyou have to do to produce a bourbon, and so that kind of keeps a nice,\nuh, reign on what's going on.  But, you know, it's all about educating\nand teaching people how, you know, the differences in the whiskeys\nand the products out there.  But it's pretty common and, uh, you know,\nit's, but you just have to keep up the good fight and teach people,\nteach people the difference if they're willing to learn it.  Um, and,\nuh, I remember I walked in a bar, a bourbon bar, in London and, uh, I\nwalked in just to see what would happen.  And I said, \"What's your best\nbourbon?\" And they said, \"Hennessy.\" And I said, \"Well, okay; well, we\ngot some work to do here.\" So now, those are all, you know, it's pretty\ncommon.  I find it every time I go out almost, to be honest with you,\nso.\n \nTROLAND: During the ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3120.0,3180.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"presidential primary campaign, Hillary Clinton\nfamously had a beer and a shot in Pennsylvania, and the shot was Crown\nRoyal.  Would you have made another suggestion to her in choosing her\nshot?\n \nWHEATLEY: I absolutely would have.  You know, uh, she, she did a shot\nof Canadian whiskey and, uh, the, uh, you would think that you would\nwant to stick with an American spirit since, you know, it's kind of\nimportant.  But, you know, I would have recommended, uh, a beer and\na shot, I would probably have recommended a Buffalo Trace because\nof, you know, it's, like I say, the best overall bourbon and for the\nmoney; um, eight-year-old.  But if she was going to really do a shot,\nyou know, we could have offered her a fifteen-year George T. Stagg\n140 proof.  That's put, you know, she would have said something about\nthat, I guarantee.  So, uh, yeah.  I could have offered her all kinds\nof different options there.  And, uh, you know, speaking of that,\nsomebody told me the other day the first spoken word on television by\na woman was about whiskey, and I didn't know ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3180.0,3240.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that; said something about\ndrinking a whiskey or something.  But I learned that the other day.\n \nTROLAND: It's not considered a good idea to ask a, a parent which of his\nor her two children is the favorite, but I'm going to ask you a similar\nquestion.  If you had to sit down and have a glass of bourbon at home,\nfor example, uh, what would you choose?\n \nWHEATLEY: Well, I choose all the time Buffalo Trace because, again, I\nwas in on that, the voting process, and I voted for the eight-year-old.\nUm, but my everyday bourbon is Buffalo Trace.  And I drink it with\neverything, um, and I also mix it with cocktails; you know, Manhattans\nand Old Fashioneds and--um, but I love having things like George\nT. Stagg underneath the bar and being able to bring that out on a,\nyou know, for a conversation piece or, uh, you know, for a nightcap\nor something when somebody's there.  Um, I love having those things\navailable, part of the antique collection, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3240.0,3300.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to--to come out on special\noccasions, and so I really do like the best of both worlds.  We have\nall the different flavors there are, really.  We have rye whiskeys and\nsmall batches, single barrels and everyday bourbons.  And, uh, so I do\nlike the fact that we have all those options, but my best overall is\nBuffalo Trace.\n \nTROLAND: What's the strategy behind the Experimental Collection?\nObviously each, each, um, issuance of an Experimental Collection\nproduct is very, very limited.  So only a very few people ever have a\nchance to taste it, and obviously it has little effect on the overall\nbottom line of the distillery because the production is so small.  What\nis therefore the strategy in terms of, uh, the distillery itself and,\nand marketing with the Experimental Collection?\n \nWHEATLEY: The Experimental Collection has nothing to do with\nmoney because if we did it for money, we wouldn't do it.  Um, the\nExperimental Collection for us is literally to go ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3300.0,3360.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"out and find the best\noverall flavor that we can find and what are the factors that go into\ncreating those flavors.  And so for us it's 100 percent educational\nand being able to get, uh, feedback from customers and from people to\nget excited about the products and understand why we do what we do.\nAnd, uh, so really it's all about, uh, education and learning and,\nand being professionals in the trade and being able to really have a\nfirm handle on what we do for a living.  So, um, it has nothing to do\nwith money and, uh, and we hear about that.  Uh, you know, people, \"Why\nwould you do that if you can't make any money on it?\" And really, uh,\nit's not about that, and I said that earlier.  We're lucky to be able\nto do those things because we are privately held, and we can make those\ndecisions, um, based on trying to produce these different products\n","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3360.0,3420.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and, and like I say, education and learning about the products that we\nproduce.  So it's all about that.\n \nTROLAND: Okay, why don't we stop here.\n \n \n[Pause in recording.]\n \n \nTROLAND: Okay.  Uh, once again, this is Tom Troland.  We're interviewing\nHarlen Wheatley who is the master distiller at Buffalo Trace\nDistillery.  October 30, 2008, Buffalo Trace Oral History Project, and\nwe are at the Buffalo Trace Distillery.  Harlen, tell me a little bit\nabout your, uh, your young adulthood as you graduated from college--uh,\nexcuse me--as you graduated from high school, what were you thinking\nand where did you go and what did you do?\n \nWHEATLEY: You know, I, I haven't told a lot of people this, but in\nhigh school, um, my worst subject was chemistry.  And, um, I did very\nwell in every subject except chemistry, and it literally to me was a\nchallenge.  And, um, I said when I went to college, you know, there's\nlots of options, and ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3420.0,3480.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/59","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"my, my ba-, I have two bachelor's--my first\nbachelor's is in chemistry, and I said when I get to college, uh, you\nknow I'm going to lick this thing because I was kind of competitive.\nI'm still competitive anyway.  And, uh, you know, so my worst subject\nI decided that's gonna be my major.  And, um, I got a bachelor's in\nchemistry from Northern Kentucky University and then I knew, um, I\ndidn't really want to work in a lab the rest of my life.  And, uh,\nso I went into chemical engineering and, um, started--went, I went to\nUK--and I started that in 1991, I think, and went down and, um, started\nengineering school there and got a bachelor's in chemical engineering.\nSo, um, it was nice because I had all this chemistry background and\nunderstood chemistry pretty well at that point, and I was able to--it\nactually, I think, helped me in the engineering side because the\nfirst couple ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3480.0,3540.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/60","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of years, um, you know, were teaching you about chemical\nreactions and things, so I had a pretty good handle on that stuff and\nit really kind of helped me get a head start.  But the engineering side\nwas what really excited me.  I like, I like, I love engineering and all\nthe things that you have to do to, to be an engineer so, um, lots of\noptions out there, but, uh, growing up in this area, knowing about the\nwhiskey industry in general, um, you know, there was a position that\ncame available after I graduated working under the master distiller in\nan, um, in an apprenticeship basically, and then once he retired then\nI would--if everything worked out--I would take his job.  So for me it\nwas a perfect opportunity.  Uh, the chemical engineering is perfect for\nthis position because you're using a lot of the engineering and a lot\nof the chemistry, and, uh, I learned about separations and distillation\nand all those things before I got here ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3540.0,3600.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/61","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so it really helped me get a\nhead start on, uh, learning the day-to-day activity.  But really you\ndon't learn the distilling process for spirits until you get on the job\nbecause there's so many different, uh, things that you have to learn\nand you have to learn about this plant and how things operate and why\nthings do what they do.  And you never really stop learning.  I asked\nthe guy before me--his name was Gary Gayheart and he worked here for, I\nthink, thirty-six years, started in 1969 which was the year I was born,\nand, uh, he worked the same length of time as his predecessor which I\nthought was unusual--but, uh, I ask Gary right before he left, and I\nsaid, \"Do you ever stop learning?\" And he said, \"No.\" Um, he learned\nstuff every day just like I did, and it was nice because we would\nbounce ideas off each other.  And I worked for him for ten years, and,\nuh, it was, it was a great relationship. ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3600.0,3660.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/62","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He was an awesome guy to work\nfor, an awesome, awesome distiller; knows his stuff.  And, uh, it was\ngreat for me because I drew from all this great experience, uh, just\nlike with Ronnie and, uh, I'm able to take all this great experience\nand blend it with some of the new technologies and new ways of doing\nthings and so on.  So, um, I had to, I had a pretty good setup, you\nknow.  It was all by design and I chose those things, but, um, it's,\nuh, it's a pretty good setup.  And so once Gary retired in 2005, early\n2005, then they made me the master distiller, so--\n \nTROLAND: So do I understand from what you've said that when you were\nfirst hired it was somewhat envisioned that you would take this\nposition?\n \nWHEATLEY: Yeah.  Absolutely.  It was an apprenticeship program, and I\nworked until 2000.  Uh, I started in '94 and worked until 2000, uh, and\nthen they named me the distiller.  They call them just the distiller,\nuh, and really you're ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3660.0,3720.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/63","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the, you're the guy, you know, going around and,\nuh, getting the things done, and, and, uh, Gary was overseeing, you\nknow, my, my good things and bad things and teaching me the right ways\nto do things.  And, uh, so it was a nice transition.  I mean, we did,\nliterally we planned it out pretty well.  It was really Gary and I\ndoing all the planning, you know, on how to do what and when to do what\nbut, uh, it's been a very nice and smooth transition, you know, to what\nwe're doing now.\n \nTROLAND: What do you think there was about you and your preparation--\n \n \n[Pause in recording.]\n \n \nTROLAND: What do you think there was about you and your background that,\nuh, made you, uh, attractive to the distillery for this position, and\nwhat is it, what is it that you think best prepared you, uh, for this\nposition?\n \nWHEATLEY: I think what they were looking for is somebody young and\nenthusiastic about coming into a, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3720.0,3780.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/64","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"um, you know--at the time when I\nstarted, you know, I don't like to talk a lot about doom and gloom,\nbut things, the industry wasn't booming like it was, like it is now,\nand at the time when I started, things were just starting to turn\naround, and they wanted some, I think, some new blood.  Get some, a\nyoung guy like myself at the time--and I'm still young--but get a new\nguy in and, and try to, you know, get some excitement going on some of\nthe things that we were trying to get accomplished.  I think that was\nsomething that attracted them to that.  You know, I'm thinking from\nmy perspective.  I'm sure that's what they were thinking and then,\nyou know, the education is important because it was probably easier\nfor Gary to explain certain things to me and try to grasp, uh, some of\nthe areas.  And at the time, the distillery was at the end of some bad\ntimes, and a lot of the things were falling apart and we had to do a\nlot of engineering to, uh, upgrade some ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3780.0,3840.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/65","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"things and do some things to\nget us back on track, um, and get us producing the way we're producing\nnow.  If we would have continued the same path when I started, this\nplace wouldn't be here.  I mean, you know, the place was just not, uh,\nneglected basically, and so I think the engineering and the chemistry\nside and the young, you know, enthusiastic helps.  And, uh, they didn't\nknow what they were getting into, of course.  You know, you never do\nuntil, until I started, but, uh, I think that's what got them, got them\nstarted and then once I got here, you know, I tried to work hard, and I\nstill do--(coughing)--and, um, that's the idea to work hard and try to,\ntry to cover all the bases, you know?\n \nTROLAND: Distilling legend Pappy Van Winkle once famously said that no\nchemists were allowed at his distillery in Louisville.\n \nWHEATLEY: Yeah.\n \nTROLAND: How do you react to that?\n \nWHEATLEY: Well, it's all--and that's just exactly what you said, legend\nbecause, uh, everybody knows you have to have a ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3840.0,3900.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/66","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"chemist and, uh, you\nknow that, that statement literally means that at the end of the day\nit's all about taste and flavor.  And, uh, you can analyze and figure\nout chemical compounds, esters and talk about aldehydes and all these\nthings, but at the end of the day it's all about how does it taste\non your palate.  So you could get away without a chemist, but it's\nnice to have that chemist backing you up saying, \"Well, this is the\nreason why you taste the way it does,\" and, \"This is how you make it\na consistent product.\" And so, you know, that statement is, uh, means\na lot actually.  It means, you know, the focus is on flavor and making\ncustomers happy, and the chemist is, is not a neces-, necessity on the\nday that you taste it.  But when you're producing stuff, it's nice to\nhave that chemist to help you produce a consistent product, so every\ndistillery has one. (laughs) ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3900.0,3960.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/67","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I can tell you that, and even back then\nthey had one, so.\n \nTROLAND: Bourbon is obviously a product of, of great tradition but also,\nuh, there are innovations as you've discussed that, uh, affect the\nproduct and will continue to affect the product in the future.  Where\nwould you like to see bourbon go in the future in terms of either taste\nprofile or marketing or production?\n \nWHEATLEY: Well, I think, you know, to be honest I've been pretty happy\nwith the path that bourbon has taken because I think bourbon has taken\nkind of the high road.  Uh, we, we haven't really focused on the, uh,\nyou know, I don't know what you want to call the, uh--we've taken the\nhigh road.  In other words, uh, the products that are produced are, uh,\nwith, with pride, you know.  People look at it as a, as a product that\nhas a lot of quality. It's all about, uh, time and technique, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=3960.0,4020.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/68","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and, so\nI think for everything that I've seen out on the market, that's kind\nof what people are um, using as the selling point and I think it's in\nthe right direction.  I think as, as we go on and we educate all these\npeople that are, that are uneducated about bourbon, I think as long as\nwe stick to the high road, uh, then I think we're gonna, we're gonna\nbe on the right path.  I think it's a product kind of like the scotch\nindustry that is going to be around forever.  I mean, uh, I just don't\nsee, uh, product being faded out or a fad.  I think, I think once\npeople understand bourbon, they're on it for life, and, um, there's a\nreason for that.  And so I think we're on the right track.  I'd like\nto see more education.  I'd like to see, not necessarily commercials,\nbut I'd like for people to understand there is an alternative to beer\nand wine and all the-, these other drinks that they're having.  And so\nthat's ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=4020.0,4080.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/69","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what I'd like to see, to be able to walk into a bar and order\na bourbon, and they say, \"Okay.  We've got Jim Beam, we've got Buffalo\nTrace and we've got Wild Turkey.\" And we've got these bourbons, you\nknow, they know what they're talking about.  That's what I, that's\nreally what I'd like to see, and I think someday we'll get there, you\nknow.\n \nTROLAND: If a history were written of Buffalo Trace Distillery let's say\nthirty, forty years from now and one part of that history was, uh, the\nstatement that in, let's say, 2015 a new bourbon product was introduced\nby Buffalo Trace that was a tremendous success--it was a bit different\nfrom what had been produced before and became very popular--any\nthoughts about what that new product might, might be like?\n \nWHEATLEY: Well, the nice, the nice thing for us is we are preparing\nfor doing that.  We have a mechanism for coming up with new products;\nnamely through the experimental program or, uh, experimental ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=4080.0,4140.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/70","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"process.\nSo, uh, we do have a mechanism for coming up with new products, and\nfor us it's, it's going to be one of those things where we've made\nthese products and all these different types of products and all of a\nsudden, eureka.  All these combinations of things come together, and\nthis is the product that we need, that we need in the marketplace.  So\nI think it's going to be a, uh, uh, evolution for us.  I don't think\none day they're going to say, \"We need to come up with a new product.\"\nIt's just going to be an evolution, and we're going to come up with\nsomething, uh, through all these steps that we're taking, and, uh, I\nthink it's going to happen.  Um, and we work on it every day, different\nprojects, but at the end of the day, we're going to come up with\nsomething based on all these, all this work that we're doing, so--and\nwe're one of the few people that do that, too; um, maybe the only, I\ndon't know.  I'm sure there's other people experimenting, but--so it'll\nbe there.\n \nTROLAND: ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=4140.0,4200.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/71","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Do you envision someday there might be countless decades in the\nfuture a product called Old Wheatley named in your honor and probably a\nwheat, uh, flavored bourbon?\n \nWHEATLEY: That's not the first time I've been asked that.  I think, uh,\nyou know, I would love for that to happen, of course.  I think I've\ngot some good ide-, great ideas, good ideas on, uh, different styles\nand different ways to, you know, produce, offer bourbons to the public.\nUm, who knows, you know? And that's not entirely up to me, of course,\nbut, uh, if it was up to me I'd already have one, right? But, uh, you\nknow, there may, there may be, you know? And that's kind of the, you\nknow, based on history, that, people do that.  So, um, you know, if,\nGod willing, my health holds up and I'm around that long, you know, and\nwe might see something like that.  So--\n \nTROLAND: Speaking of this at least imaginary history of Buffalo Trace\nDistillery, imagine such a history written fifty years in the future\nwhich, among other things, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=4200.0,4260.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/72","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"described your tenure here as master\ndistiller.  What, ideally, would you like to see written about you in\nsuch a book?\n \nWHEATLEY: I'd like to see that, um, in, in fifty years that they say\nthat, uh, \"He was, uh, an extreme, uh, professional, and he maintained,\nuh, and improved, um, the distillery and, uh, carried the torch well.\"\nAnd, uh, really that's all you can ask for.  At the end of the day,\nuh, as long as, uh, it was a little better than when I left it, uh,\nthan when I started, um, then I think, you know, I think I've done\nsomething.  And, uh, you know, this place, like I say, has been here\nfor so long that, uh, if you can have a little, uh, improvement in a\nchunk of that time then, you know, I think it's kind of a fortunate\nthing.  So, uh, that would be, that would be what I hope they would say\nthat he made a very nice, ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=4260.0,4320.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/transcript/4/annotation/73","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"uh, consistent product and, uh, improved the,\nuh, the distillery overall.\n \nTROLAND: Is there anything else you'd like to say that, uh, I haven't\nasked you?\n \nWHEATLEY: Oh, I don't know.  You've covered the bases.  You've done a\ngood job.  I don't know.  I don't know of any.\n \nTROLAND: Well, Harlen, thank you very much for taking out time for this\ninterview.  We appreciate it very much.\n \nWHEATLEY: Thank you.\n \n \n[End of interview.]\n \n \n \n \n \n ","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=4320.0,4380.0"}]},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/index/4","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["2009oh021_bik003_wheatley_ohm.xml [Index]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/index/4/annotation/74","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Origins of bourbon whiskey","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Title"]}}],"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1.0,337.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/index/4/annotation/75","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Harlen Wheatley is introduced. He talks about his background growing up and being educated in Kentucky. He discusses the origins of the name bourbon whiskey as well as the product itself. He talks about how the process of aging whiskey was accidentally discovered.","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Synopsis"]}}],"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1.0,337.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/index/4/annotation/76","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"My name is Tom Troland and we're interviewing today Harlen Wheatley who is the master distiller at Buffalo Trace Distillery.","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Partial Transcript"]}}],"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1.0,337.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/index/4/annotation/77","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Alcohol--Law and legislation","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Subjects"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Bourbon County (Ky.)","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Subjects"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Bourbon whiskey","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Subjects"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Economic conditions.","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Subjects"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Whiskey industry--Kentucky","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Subjects"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Whiskey industry--Kentucky--History.","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Subjects"]}}],"target":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4#t=1.0,337.0"},{"id":"https://nunncenter.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1/collection_resources/4/file/4/index/4/annotation/78","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Aging","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"College","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Discovery","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Florence (Ky.)","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Inventory","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Kentucky","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Laws","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Market","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Mississippi River","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Mt. 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